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Post by smileypete on Nov 28, 2016 14:07:53 GMT
It is in the engine room, where the temperature is typically less than 10 degrees C occasionally 5. The reason I think it is faulty, and not operating on a temperature controlled equalisation charge is that the out put voltage is not constant, and cycles from 13.8 upto 15.5 in a short period of time. It would be interesting to see what happens if I warm up the engine room. I don't know the criteria it uses for EQ but in winter with less solar input it may be more likely to trigger. For open type batts at 5°C, the manufacturers recommended temperature compensated charge voltage may well be 15.5V Exactly what batts do you have and what batt setting is the controller set to?
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Post by peterboat on Nov 28, 2016 14:12:06 GMT
Mine was done just like that the Midnite I have now can be paired but its a lot more expensive than the tracers and cleverer to be honest Had a look at the site the TSMPPT talk to each other when connected to the same bus clearly my Tracers didnt like each other so didnt talk!!
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2016 14:12:13 GMT
It is in the engine room, where the temperature is typically less than 10 degrees C occasionally 5. The reason I think it is faulty, and not operating on a temperature controlled equalisation charge is that the out put voltage is not constant, and cycles from 13.8 upto 15.5 in a short period of time. It would be interesting to see what happens if I warm up the engine room. I don't know the criteria it uses for EQ but in winter with less solar input it may be more likely to trigger. For open type batts at 5°C, the manufacturers recommended temperature compensated charge voltage may well be 15.5V I am not overly concerned at the moment,as I was aware that the lower temperature would allow for a higher charging voltage, although mine may be a bit on the high side. It is the fact that its not a steady voltage that is being achieved. I guess this won't do the batteries any harm . You have given me a good idea though, to increase the temperature in the engine room and monitor the effect on the charge voltage, so thanks for that.
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Post by smileypete on Nov 28, 2016 14:16:16 GMT
Mine was done just like that the Midnite I have now can be paired but its a lot more expensive than the tracers and cleverer to be honest As said it's hard to say without specific info or being able to look it it in person. An MPPT is just a glorified 'buck converter' with intelligent output current limiting to maximise solar power until the charge voltage is reached. Tracers are usually pretty reliable by all accounts, I'm sure a few do go faulty maybe sometimes the problem lies elsewhere.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2016 14:17:53 GMT
Mine was done just like that the Midnite I have now can be paired but its a lot more expensive than the tracers and cleverer to be honest Mine is also connected like that now. Previously I had four panels connect in series-parallel through one controller, but decided to change it due to shading and because I felt the controller was undersized for the array.
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Post by smileypete on Nov 28, 2016 14:21:32 GMT
Mine was done just like that the Midnite I have now can be paired but its a lot more expensive than the tracers and cleverer to be honest Mine is also connected like that now. Previously I had four panels connect in series-parallel through one controller, but decided to change it due to shading and because I felt the controller was undersized for the array. Some people go for an 'oversized' array with MPPT to give more power in spring and autumn. An MPPT will limit the current output to the max it can handle even if the array can supply a lot more power.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2016 14:27:15 GMT
It is in the engine room, where the temperature is typically less than 10 degrees C occasionally 5. The reason I think it is faulty, and not operating on a temperature controlled equalisation charge is that the out put voltage is not constant, and cycles from 13.8 upto 15.5 in a short period of time. It would be interesting to see what happens if I warm up the engine room. I don't know the criteria it uses for EQ but in winter with less solar input it may be more likely to trigger. For open type batts at 5°C, the manufacturers recommended temperature compensated charge voltage may well be 15.5V Exactly what batts do you have and what batt setting is the controller set to?My batteries are cheapy 110Ah wet cell batteries. The tracer was initially set for wet cell batteries, but in an attempt to lower the voltage and also stop the equalisation charge I have tried various attempts at changing the setting to "gel" type and "sealed" . The change in setting appears to have little effect.
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Post by JohnV on Nov 28, 2016 14:31:29 GMT
Mine is also connected like that now. Previously I had four panels connect in series-parallel through one controller, but decided to change it due to shading and because I felt the controller was undersized for the array. Some people go for an 'oversized' array with MPPT to give more power in spring and autumn. An MPPT will limit the current output to the max it can handle even if the array can supply a lot more power. This is basically what I decided on. I have bought 4 off 260W panels and a tracer 40A MPPT controller, went and picked up the bits last week. Been busy getting together the Unistrut bits for a swiveling frame work to go on the wheelhouse roof. Of course the low voltage panel in the engine room was wired 10 years ago with the correct cable sizes/breakers for the installation then ....... Mr Sod and his Law are now making me run new bigger cables and move units around so they all fit on the wooden board on the engine room bulkhead
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2016 14:32:08 GMT
Mine is also connected like that now. Previously I had four panels connect in series-parallel through one controller, but decided to change it due to shading and because I felt the controller was undersized for the array. Some people go for an 'oversized' array with MPPT to give more power in spring and autumn. An MPPT will limit the current output to the max it can handle even if the array can supply a lot more power. That is the reason I added to my array, to make it "oversize" in an attempt to harvest more sun at the beginning and end of the season, i.e in April and October, although not sure it was worth the effort/expense for little added value. I understood the controller limiting the output only after I had modified my setup, but still tell myself it was worthwhile in order to overcome the shading problem.
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Post by smileypete on Nov 28, 2016 14:34:10 GMT
My batteries are cheapy 110Ah wet cell batteries. The tracer was initially set for wet cell batteries, but in an attempt to lower the voltage and also stop the equalisation charge I have tried various attempts at changing the setting to "gel" type and "sealed" . The change in setting appears to have little effect. As per The Battery FAQ, 15.5V is probably ideal for wet unsealed batts at about 5°C. Maybe look again in spring/summer, the 'problem' may well have gone away. But do keep an eye on the electrolyte levels in the mean time. What charge current do you get at 15.5V and how many batts are they? With batts near freezing I suspect it's just going to tickle them if that.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2016 14:35:29 GMT
Some people go for an 'oversized' array with MPPT to give more power in spring and autumn. An MPPT will limit the current output to the max it can handle even if the array can supply a lot more power. This is basically what I decided on. I have bought 4 off 260W panels and a tracer 40A MPPT controller, went and picked up the bits last week. Been busy getting together the Unistrut bits for a swiveling frame work to go on the wheelhouse roof. Of course the low voltage panel in the engine room was wired 10 years ago with the correct cable sizes/breakers for the installation then ....... Mr Sod and his Law are now making me run new bigger cables and move units around so they all fit on the wooden board on the engine room bulkhead FWIW I have 4 x 250W. 1 connected to a Tracer 20A, and the other 3 connected in series through a 60A. All 4 panels are held to the roof with large pot magnets. Its still an ongoing project, but so far am pleased with it. (except for the high voltage problem-see above)
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2016 14:37:23 GMT
My batteries are cheapy 110Ah wet cell batteries. The tracer was initially set for wet cell batteries, but in an attempt to lower the voltage and also stop the equalisation charge I have tried various attempts at changing the setting to "gel" type and "sealed" . The change in setting appears to have little effect. As per The Battery FAQ, 15.5V is probably ideal for wet unsealed batts at about 5°C. Maybe look again in spring/summer, the 'problem' may well have gone away. But do keep an eye on the electrolyte levels in the mean time. Thanks. Electrolyte is fine. I am going to crank up the temperature and see what happens, but even so, would expect a fairly constant charge voltage, which I am not currently getting.
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Post by smileypete on Nov 28, 2016 14:39:09 GMT
What sort of tail current does it fall to at 15.5V?
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Post by Deleted on Nov 28, 2016 14:40:28 GMT
My batteries are cheapy 110Ah wet cell batteries. The tracer was initially set for wet cell batteries, but in an attempt to lower the voltage and also stop the equalisation charge I have tried various attempts at changing the setting to "gel" type and "sealed" . The change in setting appears to have little effect. As per The Battery FAQ, 15.5V is probably ideal for wet unsealed batts at about 5°C. Maybe look again in spring/summer, the 'problem' may well have gone away. But do keep an eye on the electrolyte levels in the mean time. What charge current do you get at 15.5V and how many batts are they? With batts near freezing I suspect it's just going to tickle them if that. I would have to check that, there a 4 batteries, relatively new. Have just done a quick check (1500 so sun quite low now). Voltage =14.8V charge current =0.2A, it won't go to 15.5, so perhaps it is,as you say a temperature compensated equalisation voltage I have been seeing. Will check again tomorrow (if the suns out). Thanks for the tips and ideas!
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Post by geo on Nov 28, 2016 14:55:06 GMT
Solar is a new field for me, never having had any dealings with it before (In my book, it's ok knowing the theory but there ain't nuffin like hands on experience) I was considering getting from Bimble as follows for a 24V system3 x 260 W panels an MPPT controller However I was thinking of getting the 60 A Outback MPPT controller Instead of the 40A MPPT controller that Bimble recommend for that number of panels (My reasoning behind the Outback controller was to allow for increasing the number of panels to 4 or even 6 at a later date) What does the panel think Am I being OTT with the controller ? (Existing battery bank is a fairly new 280 Ah bank of Varta LFD140 sealed leisure and existing inverter is a 1500W there are no plans to change these at the moment) John, There are advantages and disadvantage of wiring panels in series. The most important disadvantage is I understand and have seen, is that if panels are wired in a series run and one gets shaded or partially shaded it reduces the power and voltage from the whole series, almost totally. Something as small as a 1 inch shadow across the panel will do it. Try it when you get the panels, wire them in series, making sure they are in full light, measure the voltage output and then shade a part of one panel and repeat the voltage readings. I know you will be careful and observe normal safety when you do it. I would suggest wiring in parallel. As to paralleling two controller outputs, if the are going into an inverter or similar where there is no voltage feedback fine. If the two are feeding a battery then they act just like any charger and react to the battery voltage and one hopefully switch off and thus a reduction in the power available. I have seen two controller chopping and changing. I would suggest use a single controller. As for an MCB or something between the panels and the controller. It can be an advantage to be able to isolate the controller from the panels if you need to work on the system. A 2 pole switch is standardly installed on domestic installations for just that purpose.
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