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Post by naughtyfox on Jun 25, 2019 11:38:07 GMT
A few bullets would soon get rid of the problem. We are looking at pennies to solve this one.
Next!
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Post by Deleted on Jun 25, 2019 11:41:15 GMT
Just a quick question - how often do you find the door left open so no need to use a key? If you are talking about the systems I used to instal ..... then never ..... if the door remained open beyond a certain time an alarm went off and because each card or fob has a unique code then you know who last opened it and they were then in deep doo doo ..... apart from anything else that card could then be blocked from accessing anything else But would that system work for boaters - they are a bit of a mixed bunch................
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Post by Deleted on Jun 25, 2019 11:42:24 GMT
So the question then arises would license payers be happy to pay an extra £1 a week for secure water and elsan points available only to license payers? Or is that too much money? Hypothetical question. Why have a system where any hedgehog munching caravanner can dump their shit when they have never paid a penny towards boater services. Same goes for bins. The potential for abuse is huge. Why with you is it always about boaters paying more? Oh yes that brown envelope from crt! Any extra cost of a more secure lock key system would soon be mitigated by the savings on the repair budget. If cart then invested in the facilities they could then charge entry to cyclists and ramblers so creating an extra revenue stream. But the lack of imagination and joined up thinking by the different depts of cart is the limiting factor in the equation. Kris I am simply trying to provoke discussion.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 25, 2019 11:49:06 GMT
The obvious solution is the ASSA locks and a single key sent out (foc) to every license payer. By post.
Extra keys attract a fee.
Service blocks to have doors which tend to close themselves after use.
Yes it would be expensive but definitely worth it.
As for boaters doing the vandalism well let's start by putting elsan disposal in which only allows cassette use.
It would be a nice challenge to make a durable system which prevents "self pumpout" abuses.
Tricky but there must be a way.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 25, 2019 11:54:58 GMT
So the question then arises would license payers be happy to pay an extra £1 a week for secure water and elsan points available only to license payers? Or is that too much money? Hypothetical question. Why have a system where any hedgehog munching caravanner can dump their shit when they have never paid a penny towards boater services. Same goes for bins. The potential for abuse is huge. If cart then invested in the facilities they could then charge entry to cyclists and ramblers so creating an extra revenue stream. You mean pay per piss toilets? It seems to me the potential for revenue from passing cyclists and walkers here is non existent.
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Post by samsam on Jun 25, 2019 12:06:59 GMT
The obvious solution is the ASSA locks and a single key sent out (foc) to every license payer. By post. Extra keys attract a fee. Service blocks to have doors which tend to close themselves after use. Yes it would be expensive but definitely worth it. As for boaters doing the vandalism well let's start by putting elsan disposal in which only allows cassette use. It would be a nice challenge to make a durable system which prevents "self pumpout" abuses. Tricky but there must be a way. Please don't blame just self pump out users. The dirtiest elsan sites I have found are too far away from the canal for most pump out users to reach. The emptying of unmascerated waste from cassettes is responsible for blockages. Use of nappies and wet wipes that block drains can only be from cassettes. Big mistake making the cassette carry cap fit so well down a 105mm waste pipe, there have been loads dropped into empty points. A pump out discharge has to be free of foreign objects and of a consistency that will pass the pump.
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Post by kris on Jun 25, 2019 12:20:47 GMT
Why with you is it always about boaters paying more? Oh yes that brown envelope from crt! Any extra cost of a more secure lock key system would soon be mitigated by the savings on the repair budget. If cart then invested in the facilities they could then charge entry to cyclists and ramblers so creating an extra revenue stream. But the lack of imagination and joined up thinking by the different depts of cart is the limiting factor in the equation. Kris I am simply trying to provoke discussion. Well you got what you wanted. It just seems with you whatever the problem the discussion is of boaters paying more ?
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Post by Deleted on Jun 25, 2019 12:23:56 GMT
Kris I am simply trying to provoke discussion. Well you got what you wanted. It just seems with you whatever the problem the discussion is of boaters paying more ? No that's not my aim if anything I would prefer to pay less but realistically there are some situations where paying more is going to make things better.
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Post by kris on Jun 25, 2019 12:25:17 GMT
If cart then invested in the facilities they could then charge entry to cyclists and ramblers so creating an extra revenue stream. You mean pay per piss toilets? It seems to me the potential for revenue from passing cyclists and walkers here is non existent. You say that, but there are no free to use toilets for cyclists and ramblers. Part of the Leeds Liverpool is the pennine way. So I think a subscription for people who wanted to use the facilities would make money in some areas obviously more in the rural areas than the urban areas. it would all be extra money especially if they started getting money from all the people in camper vans who empty their elsans for the one off price of a key at the moment.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 25, 2019 12:28:10 GMT
Please don't blame just self pump out users. The dirtiest elsan sites I have found are too far away from the canal for most pump out users to reach. The emptying of unmascerated waste from cassettes is responsible for blockages. Use of nappies and wet wipes that block drains can only be from cassettes. Big mistake making the cassette carry cap fit so well down a 105mm waste pipe, there have been loads dropped into empty points. A pump out discharge has to be free of foreign objects and of a consistency that will pass the pump. I suppose you are right in that most canal boat pumpout toilet installations (not all) have some sort of maceration system in place. Either the high power centrifugal slinger pump with blades like the Tecma or the macerator jabsco type. Some including mine have diaphragm pumps which would as it happens let wet wipes through not that we ever use them obviously ! I was not thinking of the blockage problem more of the overflow potential when it goes wrong.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 25, 2019 12:29:24 GMT
You mean pay per piss toilets? It seems to me the potential for revenue from passing cyclists and walkers here is non existent. it would all be extra money especially if they started getting money from all the people in camper vans who empty their elsans for the one off price of a key at the moment. Agreed but how would you propose to charge people ? Realistically
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Post by kris on Jun 25, 2019 12:33:06 GMT
it would all be extra money especially if they started getting money from all the people in camper vans who empty their elsans for the one off price of a key at the moment. Agreed but how would you propose to charge people ? Realistically Simple have you not been reading the thread? By changing the locks to electronic ones and controlling access. It would stop boaters who haven't paid a liscence from having acess as well. So what's not to like?
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Post by Deleted on Jun 25, 2019 12:36:24 GMT
How do random members of the public access these locks?
I agree entirely with license payers having unique access but not quite sure how you would get the ramblers and cyclists into it while preventing camper van users.
Or do they get access as well.
Eta maybe it could all be app controlled.
I just can't see random members of the public paying a subscription but then a lot of people have NT membership so its not impossible I guess.
Maybe canals should be taken on by the National Trust (oh god no)/
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Post by Deleted on Jun 25, 2019 12:42:25 GMT
I did wonder when considering boating in France if their elsan emptying points looked like this
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Post by kris on Jun 25, 2019 12:47:33 GMT
How do random members of the public access these locks? I agree entirely with license payers having unique access but not quite sure how you would get the ramblers and cyclists into it while preventing camper van users. Or do they get access as well. Eta maybe it could all be app controlled. Everybody gets access as long as they pay a subscription, this would be included in the liscence fee. So boaters get improved and more facilities, crt get the extra revenue stream to put into the facilities so they stop being the disgrace that some of them are at the minute.All it would take is an initial investment on crt's part, but unfortunately at the moment they are on a completely opposite path of closing the facilities down and decreasing the budget to maintain them. i see by your edit that you are beginning to get the idea, could be app based, could be personal code entered on a keypad which could be time limited so members of the public could by month passes. Anyway you get the idea, I can't see it happening under the current managment as it would take a 180 degree about turn.
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