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Smug
Aug 16, 2019 14:23:17 GMT
Post by kris on Aug 16, 2019 14:23:17 GMT
From my perspective Rog, the problem is that the issue has been hijacked by corporate interests in order to keep selling us stuff until the shit really hits the fan. Any real change that would make a difference would mean that the wheels would have to come off the political military complex. The people making all the money from the over exploitation of the planets resources would have to stop, which I can't see happening anytime soon. So in the mean time they have hijacked the environmental agenda and are selling greenwash by the bucket load, the whole extinction rebellion is a smoke screen put up by corporate interests misleading people into spending their energies unwisely. So with so much disinformation and misleading media hype, not to mention distracting technologies it's no wonder that most people don't have a clue what's going on. So sit back,relax and enjoy the ride on humans extinction express. Ps my advice is don't get rid of your boat.
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Smug
Aug 16, 2019 14:37:28 GMT
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Post by thebfg on Aug 16, 2019 14:37:28 GMT
Yes you did, but you replied to me and I was talking about icebergs. In 5000 years the ice caps may or may not of melted I think you'll find it a lot quicker than 5000 years. Not really, if the earth warms up by 3.5 degrees, most science teams are saying any where between 18 to 60CM by 2100. Now put that into the estimated 200ft, its going to take a few thousand years. I don't diasgree its happening but its not going to be overnight, I am also unsure if it is our doing. 10,000 years ago this country was covered in ice but that melted and the earth is continually warming up. It certainly was not the use of fossil fuels that started it, it may be speeding it up a bit. We won't destroy this planet but we will destroy ourselves.
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Post by kris on Aug 16, 2019 15:48:26 GMT
I think you'll find it a lot quicker than 5000 years We won't destroy this planet but we will destroy ourselves So many people know this, yet still we rush over the cliff like lemmings?
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Smug
Aug 16, 2019 18:13:58 GMT
JohnV likes this
Post by patty on Aug 16, 2019 18:13:58 GMT
We won't destroy this planet but we will destroy ourselves So many people know this, yet still we rush over the cliff like lemmings? Because Kris the fix takes effort and the majority of people don't do 'effort'....
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Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2019 18:24:52 GMT
The biggest problem with humans extracting vast tonnages of raw materials and fossil fuels is that it will cause an irreversible imbalance in the planet and it will go all skew-wiff and wobble about so much people die of knee failure and reduced mobility.
Eventually it will hit another celestial object.
Like what happens when those little weights the tyre man puts on your car wheels fall off.
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Smug
Aug 16, 2019 18:37:21 GMT
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Post by thebfg on Aug 16, 2019 18:37:21 GMT
So many people know this, yet still we rush over the cliff like lemmings? Because Kris the fix takes effort and the majority of people don't do 'effort'.... As a country we are getting there. Single use plastic, alternative power sources and recycling etc. But the more we do the less other countries do. Until every country unite I fear eventually the world will be a bad place.
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Post by bodger on Aug 16, 2019 19:30:09 GMT
The biggest problem with humans extracting vast tonnages of raw materials and fossil fuels is that it will cause an irreversible imbalance in the planet and it will go all skew-wiff and wobble about so much people die of knee failure and reduced mobility. Eventually it will hit another celestial object. possibly not, but when the magnetic field fails and the poles flip we don't know how the earth will spin - who knows, we may find that Glasgow is on the equator and Singapore is the north pole. ...................................... and as you say, it'll rock around a lot before stabilising in its new mode. one thing you can be sure of - the Antarctic icecap will melt in next to no time.
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Post by Mr Stabby on Aug 16, 2019 20:05:18 GMT
Is it ostrich like ? I remain unconvinced that man can be responsible for change in a climate that has changed constantly throughout the Earth's existence. I'd be amazed if it wasn't making a difference to be honest. When you think that just a handful of generations ago in 1800 the population of the planet was around an eighth of what it is now, and most people's energy use amounted to little more than burning a tallow candle, to what we see now. I'd be curious to know how many millions of years it took to form the oil which we burn just in the billions of cars around the world every single day, my scientific guess would be "a whole bunch".
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Smug
Aug 16, 2019 20:23:16 GMT
Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2019 20:23:16 GMT
So the efforts of a couple of hundreds years out weigh the balance of how many millenia ... ?
Vanity to think we are in control don't you think ?
Rog
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Post by Jim on Aug 16, 2019 21:11:18 GMT
We're all doomed.
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Post by Mr Stabby on Aug 16, 2019 21:22:05 GMT
So the efforts of a couple of hundreds years out weigh the balance of how many millenia ... ? Vanity to think we are in control don't you think ? Rog Whether or not this is a different issue I don't know, but in the long term it is certainly unsustainable on any scale to use resources far faster than they are being replenished. I'm sure that at some stage Mother Nature will decide to take corrective action though.
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Smug
Aug 16, 2019 21:27:27 GMT
Post by Deleted on Aug 16, 2019 21:27:27 GMT
Can't argue with that ... but aren't we then back to where we started ... other people's behaviours need to change, because I don't believe you, me and kris are the problem. Rog
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Smug
Aug 16, 2019 22:48:28 GMT
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Post by thebfg on Aug 16, 2019 22:48:28 GMT
Is it ostrich like ? I remain unconvinced that man can be responsible for change in a climate that has changed constantly throughout the Earth's existence. I'd be amazed if it wasn't making a difference to be honest. When you think that just a handful of generations ago in 1800 the population of the planet was around an eighth of what it is now, and most people's energy use amounted to little more than burning a tallow candle, to what we see now. I'd be curious to know how many millions of years it took to form the oil which we burn just in the billions of cars around the world every single day, my scientific guess would be "a whole bunch".Β But did we emit more pollution back then that we do now? You hear of all the smog around during the 1800s from all the industry building up on fact they say the effect of pollution in India and China today is comparable with that in Britainβs industrial cities in the late 19th century.
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Post by bodger on Aug 17, 2019 7:17:25 GMT
the common denominator was/is the burning of coal in the absence of any method to remove the pollutants from the chimneys, so the nature of the pollution is different - in western Europe today it is comparatively invisible. Modern technology removes many harmful particulates but not the principal culprit which is CO2.
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Post by JohnV on Aug 17, 2019 7:44:59 GMT
Giving up a Hi-tech civilisation ain't gonna happen voluntarily. Same way stopping people having children unless they are winners of a "birthright" lottery ain't gonna happen.
Either one would dramatically reduce the human element in climate change .......
On the other hand nobody knows which way the natural swing of climate change will go ......
It could suddenly get a lot hotter and we end up with a tropical climate ...... hang on ...... haven't we had that here before ?
Starting at the end of the late Dryas temperatures rapidly warmed and for nearly all the Holocene the climate was a lot warmer than today. Climate campaigners conveniently, concentrate on a temperature graph taken over the last 150 years ..... and scream "we are going to fry"
They ignore the earlier warm periods ..... the Minoan period, the Roman warm period and the medieval warm period when the temperatures were several degrees higher than today. (It's just unfortunate for their hypothesis that there has not been any evidence found for the ancient petrochemical industry)
Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that we aren't contributing and that the continued raping of natural resources isn't crazy and that we desperately need to reduce our population size or we may exterminate ourselves (and possibly quite a few other species with us)
It's just the insufferable smugness of the goody two shoes and the ridiculous hype of the campaigners who all have about as much idea of the scientific method as I have of navel gazing in eastern religions.
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