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Post by Mr Stabby on Sept 29, 2019 21:14:52 GMT
A vicar once told me "everybody goes to heaven"... A vicar once said to me "The best gift you can give anyone is to point them in the direction of Jesus Christ" so for my lads' 21st birthday presents I pointed my finger skywards and said "He's up there boys"
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Post by Deleted on Sept 29, 2019 21:57:55 GMT
Yup any belief in afterlife is just wishful thinking and due to an overdeveloped sense of self importance in the vastness and complexity of the universe. In which case it’s surprising you don’t believe in an afterlife Nick. Here’s a different take on it. The bit many people are worried about (other than the process of dying itself) is no longer existing. Well before the Big Bang, nothing existed, yet we exist now. So we already have proof that it is possible to exist after not existing (but I doubt we’ll have much control over it) If we were to exist again in infinite years time, the transition between existences would seem seamless as we’d have no mechanism to process time in between. Personally I believe there is an architect behind it all, and I think there may be a certain amount of truth behind the core of most religions and belief systems. I find it hard to believe everything is just the result of a massive cosmological accident as everything seems quite organised and logical (as opposed to chaos). I don’t think anyone really knows for sure but most of us have faith and hope in something. It’s the ones who are cocksure of themselves we need to watch out for!
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Post by Clinton Cool on Sept 29, 2019 22:01:02 GMT
I always thought you considered your importance to be one of the main 'importances' in the universe...! Yes, but only whilst I remain alive. Once I’m gone, I’m gone. So I suggest you make the most of me while I’m still around. I would, if it weren't for the fact that you're married, and I'm straight. Nice attitude you have though.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 29, 2019 22:01:48 GMT
There is no "proof" that anything didn't exist previously.
The "big bang" is simply a theory developed by humans.
It's much more likely that everything has always existed it's just that the forms change.
When you die your constituent parts simply change form. If you are incinerated then some of you becomes heat and light energy. Burial is more of a biological transfer.
Either way you still exist.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 29, 2019 22:12:05 GMT
There is no "proof" that anything didn't exist previously. The "big bang" is simply a theory developed by humans. It's much more likely that everything has always existed it's just that the forms change. When you die your constituent parts simply change form. If you are incinerated then some of you becomes heat and light energy. Burial is more of a biological transfer. Either way you still exist. Yes, I’ve often wondered whether the confusion lies in our concept of ‘nothing’. We use the number zero to denote nothing, but there is no such thing as nothing (there has probably always been something, and always will). As you say, it does seem as though it’s all about change. One theory is that matter doesn’t exist and that everything is just made up of waves. So everything we experience could just be like a hologram....ie changing waves....maan....
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Post by patty on Sept 30, 2019 5:41:28 GMT
FWIW, I don't believe in any form of after life... even less so since my mum died - conversely however, I AM talking to her as I wander down the towpath when I feel the need "just in case" there is something... - SHE believed she'd go on to a better place and be able to keep a caring eye on those left behind - I've given her numerous chances to send me some kind of sign - alas, nothing has come ... ergo, I've gone from 'hoping' to 'doubting'... I know for sure if there was anyway of mum giving me any kind of comfort from the "other side of whatever" she'd have moved heaven and earth to do so - silence speaks volumes ! My mum has been gone 17 years and dad 5, I still talk to mum especially when I manage to go to her grave, sis says there is nothing there for her now but for me her spirit is real. I update her on life, the kids and dogs..she wouldn't have been interested in Brexit so I don't share politics. With dad, I felt him very strongly at the property he finally retired too and I badly wanted to stay there when he died...sis refused to let me buy her out and the kids persuaded me not to. My youngest son reminds me a lot of dad and I guess he lives on in him...some of what he says triggers me back to the good old days when it was me and dad and a farm full of old machinery and then the wonderful garden of his final home. We all have within us a little bit of our mum/dad/grandparents etc.. In my role of nurse particularly in a ward where death ever present(25 in 3 months) I saw a few unexplainable events so my mind open to whatever there is. I have my beliefs which for me, suffice. Whatever there is or not I try to live life now to the full and I don't put off till tomorrow(unless its boring paperwork) what can be crammed into to-day.
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Post by jubjub on Sept 30, 2019 7:23:01 GMT
I think if humans were fundamentally different to animals we would have worked out how to avoid defacating by now. Yes well at least most of use a toilet and not just drop as we go...
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Post by naughtyfox on Sept 30, 2019 7:37:50 GMT
I think if humans were fundamentally different to animals we would have worked out how to avoid defacating by now. Yes well at least most of use a toilet and not just drop as we go...
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Post by thebfg on Sept 30, 2019 8:12:07 GMT
Yup any belief in afterlife is just wishful thinking and due to an overdeveloped sense of self importance in the vastness and complexity of the universe. In which case it’s surprising you don’t believe in an afterlife Nick. Here’s a different take on it. The bit many people are worried about (other than the process of dying itself) is no longer existing. Well before the Big Bang, nothing existed, yet we exist now. So we already have proof that it is possible to exist after not existing (but I doubt we’ll have much control over it) If we were to exist again in infinite years time, the transition between existences would seem seamless as we’d have no mechanism to process time in between. Personally I believe there is an architect behind it all, and I think there may be a certain amount of truth behind the core of most religions and belief systems. I find it hard to believe everything is just the result of a massive cosmological accident as everything seems quite organised and logical (as opposed to chaos). I don’t think anyone really knows for sure but most of us have faith and hope in something. It’s the ones who are cocksure of themselves we need to watch out for! So when we are dead, we will still have to put up with Nick😉😁
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Post by thebfg on Sept 30, 2019 8:13:48 GMT
I don't think there is a magical place that does not physically exist, that our souls go to.
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Post by Telemachus on Sept 30, 2019 8:36:21 GMT
As has been said, we live on in the memories of those left behind and those we have influenced whilst alive. But that is just the nature of human memory, it doesn’t mean there is an afterlife where we have consciousness,
And yes of course the matter from which we are made gets recycled, but not with any element of carried-over consciousness.
“I” am not really my body, rather my mind and consciousness. Not even my brain - that is merely a vessel for my consciousness. But just like a computer programme, when the power goes off the data in RAM is lost. It never had physical substance in the first place.
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Post by kris on Sept 30, 2019 8:45:16 GMT
And yes of course the matter from which we are made gets recycled, but not with any element of carried-over consciousness. “I” am not really my body, rather my mind and consciousness. Not even my brain - that is merely a vessel for my consciousness. But just like a computer programme, when the power goes off the data in RAM is lost. It never had physical substance in the first place. You have evidence to prove these opinions of yours that your trying to put across as facts of course? Your computer analogy doesn't work, what about ROM? I could say memories are stored in the ram and get lost but consicousness is part of the underling operating system and gets preserved in rom. Its equally valid as an idea. Ps these are not my views, im just pointing out your trying to express your opions as facts.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 30, 2019 9:17:47 GMT
A vicar once told me "everybody goes to heaven"... Are you sure it wasn't a tour guide ? He may have said Devon Rog Twat
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Post by Telemachus on Sept 30, 2019 9:39:55 GMT
And yes of course the matter from which we are made gets recycled, but not with any element of carried-over consciousness. “I” am not really my body, rather my mind and consciousness. Not even my brain - that is merely a vessel for my consciousness. But just like a computer programme, when the power goes off the data in RAM is lost. It never had physical substance in the first place. You have evidence to prove these opinions of yours that your trying to put across as facts of course? Your computer analogy doesn't work, what about ROM? I could say memories are stored in the ram and get lost but consicousness is part of the underling operating system and gets preserved in rom. Its equally valid as an idea. Ps these are not my views, im just pointing out your trying to express your opions as facts. In the context of this sort of discussion, surely everything everyone writes is their opinion? A justification used by religious extremists to justify their actions of course! Computer ROM contains only the programme, not the data that is used to make decisions and interact with the outside etc. Anyway, the analogy was less about the hardware - I don’t think I have any RAM in my brain (yet) - but about the fact that consciousness isn’t some physical thing comprising some hardware (or flesh-ware if you like). Rather it is quite similar to the data flowing through a computer in that it has no mass or energy but it does carry information. If you burn the hardware, the consciousness / data flow or whatever, doesn’t remain in any form and leaves no residue.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 30, 2019 10:05:42 GMT
I think personal beliefs, rather like sexual preferences, are very intimate private matters ... they should concern no one else.
There seems little to be gained in offering them up for public scutiny, ridicule and derision.
Rog
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