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Post by ammodels on Apr 22, 2016 11:53:33 GMT
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Post by bills on Apr 22, 2016 12:17:22 GMT
Is calling someone "part Kenyan" racist then?
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Post by loafer on Apr 22, 2016 12:18:39 GMT
Don't think so.
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Post by ammodels on Apr 22, 2016 13:42:47 GMT
Apologies I wouldnt want to hurt your feelings about the racist bit, shall we call him xenophobic then in this instance? Damn merkins coming over here telling us what to think... except for Rupe of course eh Bozza.
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Post by journeyperson on Apr 22, 2016 13:55:44 GMT
Murdoch owns a lot of media outlets but I don't think The Independent is one of them.
Ah - they were reporting an article in The Sun, sorry about that.
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Post by ammodels on Apr 22, 2016 14:04:06 GMT
Murdoch owns a lot of media outlets but I don't think The Independent is one of them. Ah - they were reporting an article in The Sun, sorry about that. No problem, I do find it worrying that someone who has been mentioned as a potential leader for this country finds it so easy to revert to stereotypes based on national identity of others quite so easily. It says a lot about modern politics and the Brexit/remain campaigns that we are seeing so many, what some might call closet racists and xenophobes feeling empowered to air some of their less salubrious beliefs shall we say? If either side got their fingers out their asses and told us the truth about the consequences of leaving/remaining it would be a very good thing.
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Post by ammodels on Apr 22, 2016 14:34:16 GMT
The thing is with Obama is that he refused to let the world see his birth certificate for a very long time. Is he a U.S. citizen at all? The President is supposed to be one. He has something to hide. Is there anything he's achieved during his reign? Free holidays for his missus and the kids. I can't say I noticed much else. I dont believe all that tea party bullshit, he was born in Hawaii that much is proven to all but conspiracy nuts of which the American right has a shit load. Medicare is a big achievement for the poor in America, dont let the GOP tell you different.
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Post by ammodels on Apr 22, 2016 15:25:11 GMT
My friend in the USA is angry about the relief for those who took 2nd-mortgages and blew it on fancy cars and luxury goods a few years back. When the crunch came and it was time for them to get kicked out of their houses - as they should have been - the Government stepped in and paid up. Well, the money that was used was from the taxes that hard-working people (my friend, for instance) who DIDN'T hock their dwelling to buy glittery bling-endowed flashy wheels. The conscientious earners supporting the laid-back lifestyle of the squanderers. Got Obama to thank for that one. I can't comment on Medicare as I don't know much about it - I can only re-tell what everyone here probably knows in that I am socialist-minded to an extent and that I approve of a well-run and transparent National Health Service. I would like to see real statistics on how surgeons, doctors, nurses and other staff perform. The old chestnut is the: "Should smokers, druggies and alcoholics get care" - and those others who choose to take health risks (such as skiers breaking their legs)? Obama isnt to blame for the sub prime cock up, blame Reagan and the deregulation of the banking industry in murca. Saving banks was deemed the most important thing in 2008, other than the rich Im not sure we benefited from it.
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Post by ammodels on Apr 22, 2016 17:08:52 GMT
I'm out of my league here, I must say, as I don't follow these things and am not really politically-minded. The Finnish stone industry? Yes! Geology in other aspects too. I was just trying to say that those who took second-mortgages and went out to fritter it away did not necessarily deserve sympathy. Or other people's money handed to them on a plate. Out of interest, what interest do you have in the USA? Are you American? My interest comes from having bumped into my friend, about 18 years ago, and gone to visit her 8 times, first trip December 2001. We (my Finnish girlfriend the Witch) had planned to drive down the Blue Ridge Parkway, and another trip around Montana, Wyoming, Idaho, Washington state & Colorada (with possibly the Dakotas thrown in) but this narrowboat came along and buggered it all up for us Heaven forbid, just interested in the sub prime crash and the depression it caused to the worlds economy, so much for Labour screwing the economy it was right wing neoliberal fucktards like Reagan and Bush and our dear Mrs T who did that, its just the shockwave was a long time coming. I would love to do route 66 in a 57 Bel Air but thats not very likely lol.
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Post by Higgs on Apr 22, 2016 20:08:59 GMT
Heaven forbid, just interested in the sub prime crash and the depression it caused to the worlds economy, so much for Labour screwing the economy it was right wing neoliberal fucktards like Reagan and Bush and our dear Mrs T who did that, its just the shockwave was a long time coming. I would love to do route 66 in a 57 Bel Air but thats not very likely lol.
Reagan and Thatcher backed the ever increasing use of credit cards to help pay for the goods that would drive industrial production, to meet the demand for goods that consumers' access to money would create. All that borrowed money financing growth. People couldn't earn enough to pay for their developing consumerism. Without credit cards, consumerism couldn't have run on wages, and there's no way these politicians wanted wages to have to increase to pay for consumerism. People today want everything now. Saving, as our parents used to do, is sensible, but not the type of consumer that could drive those two politicians' idea of how to stimulate growth. So now we have a consumer hungry society, got to have it now, wasteful generation after generation, in debt.
On President Obama, he should keep his nose out of the EU debate. On the one hand we're joined at the hips, on the other, not close enough, apparently, to stop us being placed at the back of the queue on trade deals if we leave the EU. It's bull and contradictory. We're sold the same sort of tripe every day. To be honest, part of the debate on the EU is to reclaim sovereignty; it doesn't really matter what any other heads of state think. That's the whole point; to be able to think and act autonomously without interference from other countries.
All I've noticed since my younger days is the wreck caused by constant meddling that, all in all, hasn't brought us a better world, and goodness knows what these leaders think looks like a better place. Whatever their' vision, it is totally underwhelming, so far.
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Post by ammodels on Apr 22, 2016 20:30:10 GMT
Heaven forbid, just interested in the sub prime crash and the depression it caused to the worlds economy, so much for Labour screwing the economy it was right wing neoliberal fucktards like Reagan and Bush and our dear Mrs T who did that, its just the shockwave was a long time coming. I would love to do route 66 in a 57 Bel Air but thats not very likely lol.
Reagan and Thatcher backed the ever increasing use of credit cards to help pay for the goods that would drive industrial production, to meet the demand for goods that consumers' access to money would create. All that borrowed money financing growth. People couldn't earn enough to pay for their developing consumerism. Without credit cards, consumerism couldn't have run on wages, and there's no way these politicians wanted wages to have to increase to pay for consumerism. People today want everything now. Saving, as our parents used to do, is sensible, but not the type of consumer that could drive those two politicians' idea of how to stimulate growth. So now we have a consumer hungry society, got to have it now, wasteful generation after generation, in debt.
On President Obama, he should keep his nose out of the EU debate. On the one hand we're joined at the hips, on the other, not close enough, apparently, to stop us being placed at the back of the queue on trade deals if we leave the EU. It's bull and contradictory. We're sold the same sort of tripe every day. To be honest, part of the debate on the EU is to reclaim sovereignty; it doesn't really matter what any other heads of state think. That's the whole point; to be able to think and act autonomously without interference from other countries.
All I've noticed since my younger days is the wreck caused by constant meddling that, all in all, hasn't brought us a better world, and goodness knows what these leaders think looks like a better place. Whatever their' vision, it is totally underwhelming, so far.
I dont disagree with much of what you say but I do not trust our politicians to do what is best for this country if we are out of the EU. Camoron and co including many in the Brexit camp would sign TTiP in a heartbeat and you can imagine them explaining with bleeding hearts how the money we were sending to Europe now cant be spent on the NHS or any of the mnay places they are atm promising to spend it because "Austerity you know"
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Post by Higgs on Apr 22, 2016 20:59:27 GMT
I dont disagree with much of what you say but I do not trust our politicians to do what is best for this country if we are out of the EU. Camoron and co including many in the Brexit camp would sign TTiP in a heartbeat and you can imagine them explaining with bleeding hearts how the money we were sending to Europe now cant be spent on the NHS or any of the mnay places they are atm promising to spend it because "Austerity you know"
Out of the EU, Britain wouldn't be party to TTiP, would they? It's primarily an agreement between the US and the EU. The threat to the NHS would be as a result of an open market being established as part of the TTiP. Basically; meaning the NHS having to be cut loose from the state and having to fight amongst a privatised system of competition. I'm not quite sure how Obama care is supposed to work, but isn't it some kind of state secured protection of the most vulnerable needing health care. That seems like a US version of the NHS.
Even with the 'spare' cash, after leaving the EU, austerity or not, the government will find a way of wasting any advantage they could have. The conservatives are all for independence and self improvement, but it is a poor philosophy for enabling groups like a society to think about all and everyone having equal opportunity and sharing resources to help the disadvantaged. It would be very destructive to allow the NHS to free fall in an open market of profiteers.
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Post by ammodels on Apr 22, 2016 21:09:27 GMT
I think any trade deal we would get from the Americans would have a mandatory signing of TTiP.
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Post by Higgs on Apr 22, 2016 21:30:45 GMT
I think any trade deal we would get from the Americans would have a mandatory signing of TTiP.
It's seems that under the present alliance of the EU, we have already been relegated to a county of Europe. We are being told that the UK would be nothing without the EU and nothing that major with it., being only a part of it, within it. Corbyn is going to favour staying within the EU, warts and all. If we're going to have warts inside the EU, I'm all for dealing with the warts, outside.
Every country inside the EU is out for what it can get for itself. It's just a confusion of ideals.
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Post by ammodels on Apr 22, 2016 21:42:25 GMT
Corbyns stance is confusing, he disagrees with everything the EU is doing right now but wants to stay in as thats the only way to reform it. Im not so sure, but if we do leave and then at some later date realise what a cock up it is we will then have very little to negotiate with to change the EU and we would even have to surrender the pound to rejoin, not something I want to see happen. Monetary union has been a failure for everyone but Germany and the Benelux states and bankers the world over.
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