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Post by Deleted on May 21, 2019 20:07:25 GMT
Or maybe not. www.canalworld.net/forums/index.php?/topic/101351-help-to-pass-bss-and-electrical-issues/Old Goat, you are a simpering idiot Quote OldGoat 287 OldGoat #13 Posted 1 hour ago Cheesh - there's so much amateurish (meaning half-cock idiot) work in all the photos to do justice to the bodgery. I was opposed to the BSS on its introduction - but these photos clearly indicate some form of oversight was / is necessary (Rob@BSS take notice...). Thank heavens it's not a petrol fuelled boat / or any gas lines nearby. I sincerely wish newcomers to living on a boat - which I assume this one is - could / would seek advice before jumping in with both feet. Won't happen. Thanks for posting on here - hopefully the mess can be sorted with some help from members herein - before you blow yourself (and others) up. This one has really "got my logo..." This little lot was discovered hiddbh behind a hob and oven 19 joints, most of which are soldered where only 7 compression joints were actually needed. The boat in question has been on waterways subject to BSS inspections since the schemes inception. No gas work had been carried out since the previous inspection. So, on the face of it bar for one eagle eyed inspector the BSS scheme is not exactly fit for purpose - judging by the state of the pipework I have ripped out it's had at least 3 inspections with that crock of shite installed. This boat had been through the hands of a well respected boat brokerage with a reputation for selling quality boats... Put your faith in the BSS scheme at your peril - more often than not it will either be failed by an idiot who doesn't know how to apply the scheme correctly or conversely passed by an idiot that doesn't know how to apply the scheme correctly. My advice? When you do find a good BSS inspector hang on to him or her for dear life!
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Post by Deleted on May 21, 2019 20:33:10 GMT
On the basis that the BSS is supposed to be all about 3rd party insurance risk (obviously us boat owners getting killed is a CRT Brucie bonus), what’s the problem?
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Post by Telemachus on May 21, 2019 22:00:42 GMT
On the basis that the BSS is supposed to be all about 3rd party insurance risk (obviously us boat owners getting killed is a CRT Brucie bonus), what’s the problem? Mission creep is the problem. But dodgy wiring can cause fires which can spread. Dodgy gas can cause explosions with collateral damage.
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Post by Deleted on May 21, 2019 22:16:23 GMT
On the basis that the BSS is supposed to be all about 3rd party insurance risk (obviously us boat owners getting killed is a CRT Brucie bonus), what’s the problem? Mission creep is the problem. But dodgy wiring can cause fires which can spread. Dodgy gas can cause explosions with collateral damage. Yes to eliminating dodgy gas installations. People do get killed by explosions. No to dodgy wiring as people usualy walk around developing fires. The current BSS excuse for CO devices is that the guy in the next boat might be running a generator and the exhaust fumes might kill you as a third party (apparently this has happened but I’ve not seen the evidence yet). 2025 - If the visual image of your boat has a negative effect on the well being of passers by, this will be regarded as a failure.
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Post by Jim on May 22, 2019 5:58:11 GMT
I don't know about others but I need no excuse to fit a co alarm. It just makes sense. That dodgy gas work though, and the failure to pick it up!
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Post by patty on May 22, 2019 6:19:15 GMT
Must have come as a shock When you pay someone to check and issue a cert you assume all ok well I do or I used to...but having seen whats 'passed' for safe here in latest house I just think all these 'safety' certs not worth the paper printed on.
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2019 6:30:52 GMT
I don't know about others but I need no excuse to fit a co alarm. It just makes sense. That dodgy gas work though, and the failure to pick it up! Have you spotted the most dangerous joint? I will give you a clue - it is in the last picture.
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2019 7:16:53 GMT
I don't know about others but I need no excuse to fit a co alarm. It just makes sense. That dodgy gas work though, and the failure to pick it up! Neither do I, but the BSS isn’t supposed to be about your personal safety, as I said, it’s supposed to be about 3rd party safety (for insurance purposes). Not to say that the BSS may change in the future to give CRT the excuse to condemn more boats and owners. I hope not. Anyway, how come you don’t have to have 4 yearly safety checks if you live in a house, camper van, caravan...?
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2019 8:21:19 GMT
I don't know about others but I need no excuse to fit a co alarm. It just makes sense. That dodgy gas work though, and the failure to pick it up! Neither do I, but the BSS isn’t supposed to be about your personal safety, as I said, it’s supposed to be about 3rd party safety (for insurance purposes). Not to say that the BSS may change in the future to give CRT the excuse to condemn more boats and owners. I hope not. Anyway, how come you don’t have to have 4 yearly safety checks if you live in a house, camper van, caravan...? Don't forget the EA and the Broads Authority require a valid BSS - the Middle Level Commission are talking about it being mandatory soon, that will hurt more boat owners than a malevolent C&RT could.
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Post by naughtyfox on May 22, 2019 8:42:25 GMT
So how about telling us who the BSS inspectors are who approved this? And the name of the brokerage?
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2019 9:07:46 GMT
Neither do I, but the BSS isn’t supposed to be about your personal safety, as I said, it’s supposed to be about 3rd party safety (for insurance purposes). Not to say that the BSS may change in the future to give CRT the excuse to condemn more boats and owners. I hope not. Anyway, how come you don’t have to have 4 yearly safety checks if you live in a house, camper van, caravan...? Don't forget the EA and the Broads Authority require a valid BSS - the Middle Level Commission are talking about it being mandatory soon, that will hurt more boat owners than a malevolent C&RT could. Do all vessels which moor up by coastal waters have to have some kind of boat safety certificate? Surely many harbours are public spaces just like canals and rivers. Personally I think a safety check at point of sale seems sensible, but I can’t see how the BSS is justified really when there is no similar scheme for other types of accommodation. One thing for sure is that CRT get a lot of revenue from it and it’s a useful stick to prod boaters with if need be. I know the BSS inspectors give quite a high percentage of the fee to CRT, but why is the fee around 3 times as much as an MOT for a car? I suppose travel cost is a factor but there are fewer overheads. Maybe the scheme would gain more support if it was marketed more as a personal safety thing. Then perhaps it could be made optional rather than compulsory.
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2019 9:51:34 GMT
So how about telling us who the BSS inspectors are who approved this? And the name of the brokerage? We have been through this before - I am not prepared to name people publicly. It isnt the correct way to deal with situations like this. I have a strong suspicion the BSS quangos know their scheme is badly implemented but have no real interest to root out the bad apples that are out there examining boats. - much more interested in getting the sales of superfluous vents and CO monitors up.
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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2019 9:59:23 GMT
Don't forget the EA and the Broads Authority require a valid BSS - the Middle Level Commission are talking about it being mandatory soon, that will hurt more boat owners than a malevolent C&RT could. Do all vessels which moor up by coastal waters have to have some kind of boat safety certificate? Surely many harbours are public spaces just like canals and rivers. Personally I think a safety check at point of sale seems sensible, but I can’t see how the BSS is justified really when there is no similar scheme for other types of accommodation. One thing for sure is that CRT get a lot of revenue from it and it’s a useful stick to prod boaters with if need be. I know the BSS inspectors give quite a high percentage of the fee to CRT, but why is the fee around 3 times as much as an MOT for a car? I suppose travel cost is a factor but there are fewer overheads. Maybe the scheme would gain more support if it was marketed more as a personal safety thing. Then perhaps it could be made optional rather than compulsory. On the EA Anglia region Short term vising vessels (particularly those coming in at Denver or the Dog in a Doublet are exempt from the BSS scheme but must comply with the standards set out by the BSS scheme Boat safety – construction and equipment standards You must make sure your vessel complies with our construction and equipment standards at all times it is kept, used or let for hire on the Anglian Waterways. These standards are set out in the ‘BSS Examination Checking Procedures for Privately Owned and Managed Boats’ and for hire boats the additional BSS Hire Boats Requirements. For other non‐private boats – for example: • small passenger boats • shared‐ownership boats managed jointly by the private owners • workboats • emergency service boats and rescue boats • hotel boats, boats let as residences or longer term accommodation, for example advertising a cabin aboard, or even the whole boat, as rentable accommodation they are contained in the ‘Boat Safety Scheme Guide (2002 edition)’. Go to www.boatsafetyscheme.org to download them. I confirm that I have read the Boat Safety Scheme Requirements. I certify that the vessel complies in every respect with the safety standard requirements set out in those guides or the Recreational Craft Directive. I will not keep or use this vessel on the Anglian Waterways unless these conditions are complied with. I understand that the Environment Agency may require me to provide information confirming compliance with these conditions or to require my vessel to be inspected.
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Post by naughtyfox on May 22, 2019 11:05:53 GMT
So how about telling us who the BSS inspectors are who approved this? And the name of the brokerage? name people publicly. It isnt the correct way to deal with situations like this. I disagree - we don't want those twats giving our boat the OK if it isn't. I'd like to know who they are so we can give them a wide berth. I think the BSS is a good idea as far as the important things go - gas, electrics, major safety issues - but CO alarms and ventilation is silly, and a price of £20 seems more reasonable.
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Post by Jim on May 22, 2019 11:43:41 GMT
Ventilation, ok is advisory, but we have had several deaths in recent years, not just in boats, from Co poisoning, I have no problem with it being mandatory. A potentially life saving device, especially if your ventilation is below regs.
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