|
Post by naughtyfox on Jun 8, 2019 21:32:59 GMT
I rather like nemesis. It's good that he came onto TB.
|
|
|
Post by Mr Stabby on Jun 8, 2019 21:40:56 GMT
Piffle, piffle, and yet more piffle. The reason why people get addicted is because of a lack of political will to go after the supply. HMRC and the Border Force go to enormous lengths to control the supply, but when 600 trucks per hour arrive on the Calais-Dover ferries alone and they have the manpower and resources to search maybe half a dozen of those trucks, then what chance have they got? I'm not saying it should be legalised because I want to see more drug use, I'm saying it should be legalised because I want to see less drug use, and less social harm because of that drug use.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 8, 2019 21:55:48 GMT
Thanks naughtyfox.
Lack of customs personnel or lack of political will - whats the difference?
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 8, 2019 22:01:33 GMT
I rather like nemesis. It's good that he came onto TB. actually that is so very 'Dances with Wolves'.... lol.
|
|
|
Post by Mr Stabby on Jun 8, 2019 22:13:33 GMT
Thanks naughtyfox. Lack of customs personnel or lack of political will - whats the difference? But it just isn't possible to prevent Class A drugs getting into the UK so the best you can hope for is to decrease the demand.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 8, 2019 23:10:57 GMT
I see it as infinitely better to a) limit the supply and don't tell me it isn't possible, anything is possible that doesn't involve witchcraft and b) exponentially increase the penalty for being involved in supply. Oh yes.
|
|
|
Post by naughtyfox on Jun 9, 2019 5:11:56 GMT
It's a bit like the guns argunent, those who want guns say they don't kill, it's people who kill. Fact is America is awash with guns and shootings are one-a-minute, Europeans are not allowed to have guns in every household and shootings are rare. But then an intruder clambers into you narrowboat at 2am and what will you do? In America you can blast them away!
So, Michael Gove wants some 'stret cred' does he? Lace his cornflakes with Spice!
|
|
|
Post by patty on Jun 9, 2019 6:24:17 GMT
Im not sure why they have to come out and admit to these ancient druggie episodes..they only did what loads of people did. My sons r competing with each other who can post the most outrageous take on this...at least its entertaining them.
I hate drugs..ripped our lives apart, legalising wouldn't have changed any outcome in our place.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 9, 2019 7:00:30 GMT
I think legalising would change more than people expect. Its not just the costs.
The method of administration would change as it would be legal and a consumer product. Perhaps a nose spray for opiates that is one of the most effective ways to get into blood stream. No particular need for needles.
Plus users would not be coming into contact with people engaged in other crime. Plus the costs per unit would be lower obviously and it would be taxable like alcohol and tobacco.
Its obviously a difficult topic to discuss without getting personal.
|
|
|
Post by JohnV on Jun 9, 2019 7:11:56 GMT
I see it as infinitely better to a) limit the supply and don't tell me it isn't possible, anything is possible that doesn't involve witchcraft and b) exponentially increase the penalty for being involved in supply. Oh yes. <iframe width="24.75999999999999" height="3.240000000000009" style="position: absolute; width: 24.75999999999999px; height: 3.240000000000009px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none;left: 15px; top: -5px;" id="MoatPxIOPT0_48910476" scrolling="no"></iframe> <iframe width="24.75999999999999" height="3.240000000000009" style="position: absolute; width: 24.76px; height: 3.24px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none; left: 1160px; top: -5px;" id="MoatPxIOPT0_96032950" scrolling="no"></iframe> <iframe width="24.75999999999999" height="3.240000000000009" style="position: absolute; width: 24.76px; height: 3.24px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none; left: 15px; top: 103px;" id="MoatPxIOPT0_64708950" scrolling="no"></iframe> <iframe width="24.75999999999999" height="3.240000000000009" style="position: absolute; width: 24.76px; height: 3.24px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none; left: 1160px; top: 103px;" id="MoatPxIOPT0_70362852" scrolling="no"></iframe> It's yet another thing that probably has no single answer. Prohibition in America was an attempt to control a drug that was in wide use by the population and that went well didn't it. America is still living with the fallout. It resulted in a massive increase in illegal activities with smugglers and suppliers becoming a vast industry, corruption and violence increased dramatically . Ok, it was a different time and a different place but look at the UK and drugs. A major part of the crime statistics are in some way drug related and that crime funds large and well organised criminal gangs. It funds corruption and the gangs branch into other illegal fields, people trafficking being an obvious one. Going after the supply and suppliers. America's war on drugs has been waged for many years now and with all the efforts of the DEA and vast sums of money and numbers of lives lost. Well that has been another thing that has gone well hasn't it. Maybe de-criminalisation has some strong arguments, a controlled cheap, pure supply to undercut the criminal gangs. Of course human nature and politicians being what they are, at a later date, some bright spark will increase the price ( i.e. put a tax on it) Then another bright spark from a different political party will begin to increase the tax and so on, ad infinitum. They will then tax it too highly (which is what is happening to alcohol now ) Crime sees a profit and starts producing counterfeit and sometimes dangerous alternatives ...... Whoopee !!! where are we now?
|
|
|
Post by JohnV on Jun 9, 2019 7:15:53 GMT
bugger I see I got the dreaded extra letters ..... why doe it only happen when it was a carefully thought out post !!!
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 9, 2019 9:19:55 GMT
I see it as infinitely better to a) limit the supply and don't tell me it isn't possible, anything is possible that doesn't involve witchcraft and b) exponentially increase the penalty for being involved in supply. Oh yes. <It's yet another thing that probably has no single answer. Prohibition in America was an attempt to control a drug that was in wide use by the population and that went well didn't it. America is still living with the fallout. It resulted in a massive increase in illegal activities with smugglers and suppliers becoming a vast industry, corruption and violence increased dramatically . Ok, it was a different time and a different place but look at the UK and drugs. A major part of the crime statistics are in some way drug related and that crime funds large and well organised criminal gangs. It funds corruption and the gangs branch into other illegal fields, people trafficking being an obvious one. Going after the supply and suppliers. America's war on drugs has been waged for many years now and with all the efforts of the DEA and vast sums of money and numbers of lives lost. Well that has been another thing that has gone well hasn't it. Maybe de-criminalisation has some strong arguments, a controlled cheap, pure supply to undercut the criminal gangs. Of course human nature and politicians being what they are, at a later date, some bright spark will increase the price ( i.e. put a tax on it) Then another bright spark from a different political party will begin to increase the tax and so on, ad infinitum. They will then tax it too highly (which is what is happening to alcohol now ) Crime sees a profit and starts producing counterfeit and sometimes dangerous alternatives ...... Whoopee !!! where are we now? I took out some erroneous "I frame" text whatever that was
|
|
|
Post by JohnV on Jun 9, 2019 9:24:57 GMT
<It's yet another thing that probably has no single answer. Prohibition in America was an attempt to control a drug that was in wide use by the population and that went well didn't it. America is still living with the fallout. It resulted in a massive increase in illegal activities with smugglers and suppliers becoming a vast industry, corruption and violence increased dramatically . Ok, it was a different time and a different place but look at the UK and drugs. A major part of the crime statistics are in some way drug related and that crime funds large and well organised criminal gangs. It funds corruption and the gangs branch into other illegal fields, people trafficking being an obvious one. Going after the supply and suppliers. America's war on drugs has been waged for many years now and with all the efforts of the DEA and vast sums of money and numbers of lives lost. Well that has been another thing that has gone well hasn't it. Maybe de-criminalisation has some strong arguments, a controlled cheap, pure supply to undercut the criminal gangs. Of course human nature and politicians being what they are, at a later date, some bright spark will increase the price ( i.e. put a tax on it) Then another bright spark from a different political party will begin to increase the tax and so on, ad infinitum. They will then tax it too highly (which is what is happening to alcohol now ) Crime sees a profit and starts producing counterfeit and sometimes dangerous alternatives ...... Whoopee !!! where are we now? I took out some erroneous "I frame" text whatever that was Thank you Andrew, that is above my IT pay grade
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Jun 9, 2019 13:00:43 GMT
If America had any real commitment to social justice it would have fixed New Orleans by now. You say the war on drugs has failed; I say it never started.
|
|
|
Post by JohnV on Jun 9, 2019 13:58:53 GMT
If America had any real commitment to social justice it would have fixed New Orleans by now. You say the war on drugs has failed; I say it never started. I was thinking more on attempts to stop production ...... All that seems to have caused is countless deaths due to competing Drug Lords and Central American countries more like war zones than anything else, with corruption off the scale. Internally, you may be right, the US is a strange society in many ways
|
|