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Post by Deleted on Aug 15, 2019 8:07:39 GMT
This is not a thread about should we or shouldn't we leave the EU.
I'm getting confused with political coverage that always appears weighted behind one camp or the other.
My understanding is that article 50 (having been extended by May) demands that on the 31 October the UK WILL leave the EU, that is UNLESS article 50 is revoked or (at the behest of the EU) further extended.
Discussions about proroguing parliament and votes of confidence are window dressing.
It requires POSITIVE action for us NOT to be out on 31 October.
Is that right ?
Rog
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Post by Deleted on Aug 15, 2019 8:11:41 GMT
Depends what you mean by positive...
But yes you are right, I think...
Edit to add - For the UK not to leave the EU on the 31 Oct, the UK has to either revoke Article 50 or request an extension, the EU can not stop Article 50 being revoked but does not have to agree an extension of the deadline.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 15, 2019 8:18:28 GMT
Yes, badly worded sorry ...
it requires action to prevent us leaving ... inaction means article 50 runs its course and we leave.
Is that better ?
Rog
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Post by Deleted on Aug 15, 2019 8:31:36 GMT
Yes, badly worded sorry ... it requires action to prevent us leaving ... inaction means article 50 runs its course and we leave. Is that better ? Rog Yes. But proroguing parliament or votes of no confidence are far from window dressing - they go right to the heart of our Parliamentary Democracy and in my view should be considered very important what ever side of the Brexit fence someone sits.
To set a precedent where Parliament/Parliamentary rules are ripped up is bad for our democracy.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 15, 2019 8:36:32 GMT
Not at issue.
What I'm asking is ... unless someone POSITIVELY takes action to revoke/extend article 50 then we are out.
Proroguing/no confidence votes won't make a difference UNLESS the POSITIVE action to revoke/extend is taken
Rog
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Post by Deleted on Aug 15, 2019 8:37:59 GMT
Not at issue. What I'm asking is ... unless someone POSITIVELY takes action to revoke/extend article 50 then we are out. Proroguing/no confidence votes won't make a difference UNLESS the POSITIVE action to revoke/extend is taken Rog You are correct then.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 15, 2019 8:41:33 GMT
As you suggest, I'm certain parliament will try every means available to prevent us leaving ... just that they don't seem capable of agreeing on ANY form of action.
Perhaps this is what gives the blonde bombshell his certainty.
Rog
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Post by lollygagger on Aug 15, 2019 8:44:48 GMT
Each time remainers pull the plug on a no deal exit, the bargaining threat of a no deal exit disappears making the likelihood of a deal... unlikely and the likelihood of no deal exit more likely. It's almost as if the remainers are fighting for a no deal exit just so they can say "told you so".
Or perhaps by willing what they perceive as a worst case scenario under the Tories, they might end up in power themselves. I think both sides are aware that whatever happens won't make a whole lot of difference to anything and what's really at stake is who's in charge after the next election.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 15, 2019 8:46:16 GMT
As you suggest, I'm certain parliament will try every means available to prevent us leaving ... just that they don't seem capable of agreeing on ANY form of action. Perhaps this is what gives the blonde bombshell his certainty. Rog We will have to wait and see how things pan out. If Mr Johnson really thinks things are certain then he is more deluded than I thought.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 15, 2019 8:48:51 GMT
Confusing isn't it. All the coverage I'm reading seems to be focussing on tactics and possible outcomes ... and seems to be bypassing the central issue. Maybe this is intentional ... we leave by default because no one actually DID anything Rog
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Post by Deleted on Aug 15, 2019 8:51:54 GMT
Confusing isn't it. All the coverage I'm reading seems to be focussing on tactics and possible outcomes ... and seems to be bypassing the central issue. Maybe this is intentional ... we leave by default because no one actually DID anything Rog The tactics are all about trying to gain control of the possible chance to do something POSITIVE.
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Post by lollygagger on Aug 15, 2019 9:05:46 GMT
Confusing isn't it. All the coverage I'm reading seems to be focussing on tactics and possible outcomes ... and seems to be bypassing the central issue. Maybe this is intentional ... we leave by default because no one actually DID anything Rog The tactics are all about trying to gain control of the possible chance to do something POSITIVE. You are gullible, it's only about who wins the next election.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 15, 2019 9:07:17 GMT
The tactics are all about trying to gain control of the possible chance to do something POSITIVE. You are gullible, it's only about who wins the next election. You are too cynical...
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Post by Deleted on Aug 15, 2019 9:12:05 GMT
Is there time to call an election, hold it, create a new government (?) assuming anyone gets a clear majority and then revoke/extend article 50?
Clock's ticking for sure.
Rog
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Post by Deleted on Aug 15, 2019 9:15:05 GMT
Is there time to call an election, hold it, create a new government (?) assuming anyone gets a clear majority and then revoke/extend article 50? Clock's ticking for sure. Rog No is the simple answer. Possibly is the technical truth, but unrealistic.
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