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Post by Telemachus on Aug 17, 2020 19:25:08 GMT
My understanding is that many electrical devices have a 'surge' demand on start up that can be up to twice the stated wattage. Doubtless someone more qualified than me will be along to confirm/ correct this shortly. I'm hoping one of these slimline machines will run on say 1kw, so that my inverter stands a chance, but I'm seeing more often recently that the running power for domestic appliances isnt quoted, but instead they give annual running costs Washing machines don’t use much, apart from the heating element. It will be fine on a 1.8kw inverter provided the heater doesn’t come on. Heater is likely to be 2kw, plus the drum motor/pump etc. Ideally one should choose a washer with a cold wash option and fill with warm/hot water for the wash, but failing that, filling with hot water that is hotter than the set temperature usually means the thermostat doesn’t cause the heater to kick in. On Ricco’s point, yes motor startup current can be much, much higher than the running current, but in the case of a washing machine this isn’t much of an issue because the motor is controlled by the computer which gives it a “soft start” that mostly eliminates the startup surge.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 17, 2020 19:28:53 GMT
I'm looking for something along these lines for when I move to Wales. There's nowhere to put a washing machine other than in the shower room. Does this machine need to be plumbed in? Not sure if this will fit Ricco, but its a few quid cheaper than some of the other models I've looked at. www.ebay.co.uk/itm/143475406912Not sure what the power rating is (yet), so I dont know if it'll work on my 1.8kw inverter, but I've asked the seller for more info. I think if I can be sure this will run, it might be the machine for me. I'm debating whether to buy it this week whilst I have an address I can get it delivered to (and cart it about in the boat until I get a chance to plumb it in on the GU), or just get by with the washing bowl for a few weeks, and then ask a friend if they will 'receive' it at their address for me.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 17, 2020 19:31:55 GMT
My understanding is that many electrical devices have a 'surge' demand on start up that can be up to twice the stated wattage. Doubtless someone more qualified than me will be along to confirm/ correct this shortly. I'm hoping one of these slimline machines will run on say 1kw, so that my inverter stands a chance, but I'm seeing more often recently that the running power for domestic appliances isnt quoted, but instead they give annual running costs Seems to be .9kw. So start-up demand is probably less than 1.8kw.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 17, 2020 19:32:30 GMT
I'm hoping one of these slimline machines will run on say 1kw, so that my inverter stands a chance, but I'm seeing more often recently that the running power for domestic appliances isnt quoted, but instead they give annual running costs Washing machines don’t use much, apart from the heating element. It will be fine on a 1.8kw inverter provided the heater doesn’t come on. Heater is likely to be 2kw, plus the drum motor/pump etc. Ideally one should choose a washer with a cold wash option and fill with warm/hot water for the wash, but failing that, filling with hot water that is hotter than the set temperature usually means the thermostat doesn’t cause the heater to kick in. On Ricco’s point, yes motor startup current can be much, much higher than the running current, but in the case of a washing machine this isn’t much of an issue because the motor is controlled by the computer which gives it a “soft start” that mostly eliminates the startup surge. Thanks for this info, I've asked the seller for the power rating of one I'm interested in on ebay. I want to be as sure as I can be that it will run before splashing out the £300. But it looks good, and it solves the problem of spinning the clothes properly so they need a lot less drying time. Very annoyingly they only give an annual power rating in the blurb.
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Post by Telemachus on Aug 17, 2020 19:36:41 GMT
Washing machines don’t use much, apart from the heating element. It will be fine on a 1.8kw inverter provided the heater doesn’t come on. Heater is likely to be 2kw, plus the drum motor/pump etc. Ideally one should choose a washer with a cold wash option and fill with warm/hot water for the wash, but failing that, filling with hot water that is hotter than the set temperature usually means the thermostat doesn’t cause the heater to kick in. On Ricco’s point, yes motor startup current can be much, much higher than the running current, but in the case of a washing machine this isn’t much of an issue because the motor is controlled by the computer which gives it a “soft start” that mostly eliminates the startup surge. Thanks for this info, I've asked the seller for the power rating of one I'm interested in on ebay. I want to be as sure as I can be that it will run before splashing out the £300. But it looks good, and it solves the problem of spinning the clothes properly so they need a lot less drying time. Very annoyingly they only give an annual power rating in the blurb. I think it is in part because the power consumption isn’t fixed. It varies from nearly zero with the drum temporarily stopped, to a few 100 watts whilst it’s turning, to a few more hundred watts whilst it’s starting to turn, to over 2kw when the heater is on. You could perhaps give the maximum power consumption but if it only used that for 50 milliseconds as the drum started to turn with the heater on, would it be useful? A 1800w inverter will have some short duration overload capability.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 17, 2020 19:37:58 GMT
I'm hoping one of these slimline machines will run on say 1kw, so that my inverter stands a chance, but I'm seeing more often recently that the running power for domestic appliances isnt quoted, but instead they give annual running costs Seems to be .9kw. So start-up demand is probably less than 1.8kw. Thanks Nemesis- I don't suppose you can estimate the running power needed for my ebay example? Its about £100 cheaper, so you know... www.ebay.co.uk/itm/143475406912
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Post by Deleted on Aug 17, 2020 19:48:11 GMT
Thanks for this info, I've asked the seller for the power rating of one I'm interested in on ebay. I want to be as sure as I can be that it will run before splashing out the £300. But it looks good, and it solves the problem of spinning the clothes properly so they need a lot less drying time. Very annoyingly they only give an annual power rating in the blurb. I think it is in part because the power consumption isn’t fixed. It varies from nearly zero with the drum temporarily stopped, to a few 100 watts whilst it’s turning, to a few more hundred watts whilst it’s starting to turn, to over 2kw when the heater is on. You could perhaps give the maximum power consumption but if it only used that for 50 milliseconds as the drum started to turn with the heater on, would it be useful? A 1800w inverter will have some short duration overload capability. I'll probably end up hanging fire for a few weeks until I can do a bit more digging. Ideally, I dont really want one that only has a cold fill (and I've just noticed this one does), because it'll use tons of power doing the heating. I could stick hot water in it manually, but that doesn't sound like a great idea- the programmes it has will be set for specific water volumes, and adding extra water might bugger it up. The idea of a washer/spinner looks a good bet for me, but I'll have do some more research. The inverter is a decent Sterling one, so upgrading it will cost a good few quid as well, so I need to avoid that. To be fair to the seller it was built for holiday cruising, not liveaboard, so 1.8kw probably looked pretty generous.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 17, 2020 19:56:18 GMT
Aha! I have a plan so cunning you could put a tail on it and call it a fox...
How about I connect my hot water supply to the cold water inlet feed of the washing machine? The water goes in at say 50 degrees from the boats hot water supply, and the machine thinks its done the job, and turns its heater back off when it senses the water is hot?
Is this the way boaters work around the power demands of these cold-water feed machines?
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Post by Telemachus on Aug 17, 2020 19:57:09 GMT
I think it is in part because the power consumption isn’t fixed. It varies from nearly zero with the drum temporarily stopped, to a few 100 watts whilst it’s turning, to a few more hundred watts whilst it’s starting to turn, to over 2kw when the heater is on. You could perhaps give the maximum power consumption but if it only used that for 50 milliseconds as the drum started to turn with the heater on, would it be useful? A 1800w inverter will have some short duration overload capability. I'll probably end up hanging fire for a few weeks until I can do a bit more digging. Ideally, I dont really want one that only has a cold fill (and I've just noticed this one does), because it'll use tons of power doing the heating. I could stick hot water in it manually, but that doesn't sound like a great idea- the programmes it has will be set for specific water volumes, and adding extra water might bugger it up. The idea of a washer/spinner looks a good bet for me, but I'll have do some more research. The inverter is a decent Sterling one, so upgrading it will cost a good few quid as well, so I need to avoid that. To be fair to the seller it was built for holiday cruising, not liveaboard, so 1.8kw probably looked pretty generous. The way a washing machine fills is thus: it opens the valve to allow water in. It doesn’t know the water pressure or flow rate. It keeps the valve open until a pressure-based level sensor detects that there is the correct amount of water in it, then it shuts the valve. Thus if you add hot water during the fill, all that happens is that the water level will reach the desired value / valve will shut off earlier than it otherwise would have done. What people do is fit a thermostatic mixer valve to the inlet of the washer. They turn the knob to give hot-ish water for the initial fill- hotter than the set temperature of the wash, to ensure the heater doesn’t kick in. Then once the wash has completed and before the first rinse, they turn the knob so that the rinses are done with cold water.
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Post by Telemachus on Aug 17, 2020 19:58:07 GMT
Aha! I have a plan so cunning you could put a tail on it and call it a fox... How about I connect my hot water supply to the cold water inlet feed of the washing machine? The water goes in at say 50 degrees from the boats hot water supply, and the machine thinks its done the job, and turns its heater back off when it senses the water is hot? Is this the way boaters work around the power demands of these cold-water feed machines? See the answer I gave moments ago! Calorifier hot water can be around 80C which is too hot for a wash, hence the thermostatic mixer.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 17, 2020 19:58:12 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Aug 17, 2020 20:06:52 GMT
Aha! I have a plan so cunning you could put a tail on it and call it a fox... How about I connect my hot water supply to the cold water inlet feed of the washing machine? The water goes in at say 50 degrees from the boats hot water supply, and the machine thinks its done the job, and turns its heater back off when it senses the water is hot? Is this the way boaters work around the power demands of these cold-water feed machines? See the answer I gave moments ago! Calorifier hot water can be around 80C which is too hot for a wash, hence the thermostatic mixer. Thank you very much Telemachus, I think I'm getting close to a solution. Just need to make sure I find the right machine for my inverter
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Post by Deleted on Aug 17, 2020 20:11:14 GMT
See the answer I gave moments ago! Calorifier hot water can be around 80C which is too hot for a wash, hence the thermostatic mixer. Thank you very much Telemachus, I think I'm getting close to a solution. Just need to make sure I find the right machine for my inverter If having a 'cold wash' program is that important it might be better to go to some megastore and wander around. But the thermostatic valve plan seems to indicate you can have whichever machine you like.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 17, 2020 20:11:55 GMT
Thanks Nemesis, you've earned an extra ration of grog, but I fear no good will come of drinking it.... I'll see if the seller can confirm the power rating before I pull the trigger on this machine. If things go to plan I'm vacating in 7 days, if not sooner, and I dont want to delay the move waiting for a delivery, so I need to make a decision on this one tomorrow really.
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Post by quaysider on Aug 17, 2020 21:09:20 GMT
On Ellis, I have a 1600 spin washer which I use a hose to fill with hot water from the calorifier (saves many, many amps) and when the fire is lit, it do it late in the day so it can dry on racks over night and be put away in the morning... OR when the engine is running, use the vented 4kg drier on half heat (full heat is too much for the aux alternator to keep up with).... on "shore days" - I peg out on a portable whirly gig wherever we are... either weighted with 2 25kg steel weights or "tent" pegged to the ground. Winter laundry is a much quicker affair drying stuff overnight when the fire is blazing compared to (indoor) summer. On guest change over, it's generally 4 loads of washing and drying to be done in 1/2 days... MUCH easier if we can do it on shoreline so these days, I try and factor in a marina over night to make life easier.
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