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Post by Deleted on Mar 29, 2021 19:37:18 GMT
I have had the jab after much reflection, and must accept the consequences of my choice.
Anyone declining the vaccine after due consideration, must surely do the same.
It is not so unusual to have to receive vaccines before international travel, and SHOULD that become necessary it would not be massively surprising.
I'm struggling to see what the human rights implications are ?
Rog
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Post by Jim on Mar 29, 2021 20:01:28 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Mar 29, 2021 20:46:02 GMT
It is not so unusual to have to receive vaccines before international travel Vaccines that have been developed with the best of intentions, and tested for around 10 years with animal and then human trials (although I think this is unfair to other animals - I am against the use of animals for cosmetics). These 'Covid vaccines' have been described as 'gene therapy' - what the heck does that mean? Knocked up in a few months, and officially registered as a trial 2021-2023. It is wrong to force people to have to take these 'vaccines' in order to be able to travel. We could argue that those who don't want to travel with the 'un-vaccinated' needn't get on that plane! Then IF vaccination is required for travel don't travel ... a consequence of your free choice. If you wish to travel and vaccination becomes a requirement, you'll have to have it. Not that complex is it ? Rog
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Post by Deleted on Mar 29, 2021 20:50:03 GMT
Yeah yeah yeah.
Covid vaccine imprinted on your passport or is there a man who can do you kosher C19 certifikit for cash?
Does cash still exist?
It would have to be pretty watertight really.
Covid passport won't happen. It's all just scare stories to get people reading bullshit on the internet and responding to advertising.
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Post by Clinton Cool on Mar 29, 2021 21:22:59 GMT
Vaccines that have been developed with the best of intentions, and tested for around 10 years with animal and then human trials (although I think this is unfair to other animals - I am against the use of animals for cosmetics). These 'Covid vaccines' have been described as 'gene therapy' - what the heck does that mean? Knocked up in a few months, and officially registered as a trial 2021-2023. It is wrong to force people to have to take these 'vaccines' in order to be able to travel. We could argue that those who don't want to travel with the 'un-vaccinated' needn't get on that plane! Then IF vaccination is required for travel don't travel ... a consequence of your free choice. If you wish to travel and vaccination becomes a requirement, you'll have to have it. Not that complex is it ? Rog You're right, it's simple. Whether public acquiesce to ever more draconian government interference in people's lives is likely to improve said lives is equally simple: no. So, the overall 'package'...isn't simple at all. And then, it wouldn't be unreasonable to conclude that public acquiesce might lead government to believe that they are free to take further control with current controls just being the thin end of the wedge. All of a sudden, it's all rather complicated. The government would like you to believe it's simple, of course.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 29, 2021 21:37:25 GMT
My sainted old Mum used to tell us kids "If ifs and ans were pots and pans, there'd be no need for tinkers" You're getting eggy about theories and speculation. You're entitled to ... but any sympathy's going to be minimal Rog
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Post by ianali on Mar 30, 2021 7:38:21 GMT
Then IF vaccination is required for travel don't travel ... a consequence of your free choice. If you wish to travel and vaccination becomes a requirement, you'll have to have it. Not that complex is it ? That's like the Nazis turning up at your house, gathering your wife and kids into a corner of one room, giving you a gun and saying you can shoot your wife and kids or not. If you don't, they will shoot you. And they will say: "A consequence of your free choice - not that complex is it?" What I am against is the Nazis not turning up in the first place. You seem happy for Covid19 'vaccines' to be forced upon people if they want to travel and claim that it's a free choice. I agree with you, and I would have preferred not to have been jabbed. However, life doesn’t last forever, sometimes you just have to go with the flow. I want to get back out living a worthwhile life, so I had it and hopefully that means il be allowed my freedom again. I hate that I’ve had to do this, and I hate the government for forcing it upon me. What will properly piss me off though is if having had it, I then get told I still can’t go out and play! The vaccines either work, or they don’t. If they don’t then I’m afraid we have to bite the bullet and accept some people will suffer.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 30, 2021 8:03:07 GMT
I've had several vaccines during my life ... I have had a tetanus booster every ten years or less ... my brother receives three jabs per day ... there is nothing particularly unusual about injections. No 'nazis' have ever been involved ... no coercion has been required ... I have no precise idea what constitutes any of the jabs but remained satisfied that it was in my best interests on medical advice. I have said, if you don't want the jab DON'T HAVE IT. It will not be forcibly given ... but you WILL have to accept the consequences just as we who have had it will. Inability to travel internationally without having had the jab is one POSSIBLE consequence ... your choice Please try and restrain your hysteria and avoid further 'nazi' references. Rog
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Post by ianali on Mar 30, 2021 8:19:16 GMT
I've had several vaccines during my life ... I have had a tetanus booster every ten years or less ... my brother receives three jabs per day ... there is nothing particularly unusual about injections. No 'nazis' have ever been involved ... no coercion has been required ... I have no precise idea what constitutes any of the jabs but remained satisfied that it was in my best interests on medical advice. I have said, if you don't want the jab DON'T HAVE IT. It will not be forcibly given ... but you WILL have to accept the consequences just as we who have had it will. Inability to travel internationally without having had the jab is one POSSIBLE consequence ... your choice Please try and restrain your hysteria and avoid further 'nazi' references. Rog Yep, can do without the nazi stuff. But,while you might argue with the definition of coercion, I feel I’ve been given little choice but to have the jab. I could have said no and then lived the life of a monk I guess...
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Post by Deleted on Mar 30, 2021 8:26:01 GMT
A bit over the top ianali ... the restrictions began to lift yesterday for everyone NOT just those who've had the jab. In June all being well the last remaining restrictions will end ... not just for those jabbed. Businesses are speculating how best to operate going forward, and such discussion is understandable ... but there have been no firm restrictions imposed on anyone (jabbed or not) yet, and apart from international travel, I think they are unlikely. Talk of 'nazis' handing guns out is hysterical nonsense isn't it ? Rog
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Post by Clinton Cool on Mar 30, 2021 8:35:18 GMT
Interesting state of affairs with these vaccines. Given that they are experimental, a clause exists that anyone who suffers harm from them may not pursue a legal remedy. Fair enough? However: British law does not allow for unfair terms to be inserted into agreements. For example; if a worker accepts a job but is made aware of a clause such as 'the firm holds no responsibility should the worker be injured or killed whilst carrying out their work' and is subsequently injured or killed, any court would judge that the term was unreasonable and therefore would ignore it, when making its judgment. Interestingly, health and safety laws apply at all times, even if the worker is carrying out the task on a voluntary basis. So, the fact that people are 'volunteering' to be injected doesn't in itself absolve the producer of the vaccine/ those who administer it from responsibility for their actions. In any case, should 'vaccine passports' come about a strong argument could be made that being injected is no longer voluntary, given that it's essential, if someone wishes to live a normal life.
Interesting times ahead in the legal industry, I predict.
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Post by ianali on Mar 30, 2021 8:39:30 GMT
A bit over the top ianali ... the restrictions began to lift yesterday for everyone NOT just those who've had the jab. In June all being well the last remaining restrictions will end ... not just for those jabbed. Businesses are speculating how best to operate going forward, and such discussion is understandable ... but there have been no firm restrictions imposed on anyone (jabbed or not) yet, and apart from international travel, I think they are unlikely. Talk of 'nazis' handing guns out is hysterical nonsense isn't it ? Rog Well, i feel I’ve been coerced, and I don’t like it. Anyway, gorgeous morning and I’ve got a boater to help out, and then a boat to sit on it’s stern with a beer. Have a good one Roger 👍
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Post by Deleted on Mar 30, 2021 10:29:08 GMT
Hysteria means emotionally charged behaviour which is excessive and out of proportion ... I think I understand your reservations but you diminish any argument with ridiculous comparisons and hysterical allegories and prophecies.
I understand that during the YEAR of restrictions, around 70,000 fines have been issued amongst the 68 million population for breaches of the restrictions ... and these largely to those participating in large gatherings like raves and house parties.
Hardly the police state you depict.
Rog
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Post by JohnV on Mar 30, 2021 11:31:19 GMT
Hysteria means emotionally charged behaviour which is excessive and out of proportion ... I think I understand your reservations but you diminish any argument with ridiculous comparisons and hysterical allegories and prophecies. I understand that during the YEAR of restrictions, around 70,000 fines have been issued amongst the 68 million population for breaches of the restrictions ... and these largely to those participating in large gatherings like raves and house parties. Hardly the police state you depict. Rog It's the coat industry innit !!!
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Post by Deleted on Mar 30, 2021 21:22:49 GMT
I had a spot of mission creep earlier on today when I was meant to be "doing something important" but it turned into a little glide up the River in the floating electric beer drinking platform.
I don't know what to do about this sort of problem, it plagues me.
"God save thee ancient mariner, from the fiends that plague thee thus! Why lookst though so?" 'With my cross bow I SHOT THE ALBATROSS.'
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