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Post by phil70 on Apr 5, 2021 9:44:46 GMT
The question is why wouldnt you? Because they donβt want it! Even if they need it? Phil
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2021 9:48:13 GMT
Foxy, as regards a vaccination not stopping a person spreading the virus just stop and think (if you can) of how the virus spreads. Why do you think there is so much emphasis on washing regularly and carefully ? viral particles are everywhere, on handrails, balustrades,shop door handles, shopping trolley handles ...... everywhere where many people touch. When a person who is vaccinated comes in contact with those viral particles they pick them up on their hands/hair/clothing. Just because they have been vaccinated doesn't mean that the virus dies as soon as it touches their skin. It only protects them from becoming dangerously ill if the virus manages to infect them, although it reduces the risk of a mild infection (it takes a while before the antibodies get to work) That vaccinated person then goes into a shop and touches the door handle, the lift button, the shopping trolley handle ... and leaves some of those particles he has just picked up on the card reader buttons when he pays for his shopping.
That is how a virus is passed round vaccinations doesn't cause the virus to magically disintegrate as soon as it touches a vaccinated person, it doesn't give you superpowers it just helps prevent you catching it at mild levels, greatly prevents you becoming ill with it and stops you dying from it.
The way vaccinations prevent the spread of a disease is that it prevents a high proportion of people from catching it at all, which means a hell of a lot less people are leaving fresh viral particles for other people to pick up.
For God's sake grow up and start using some common sense ...... if you actually have any
possibly still not clear enough for someone who choses not to see ..... The problem is, lots of conflicting information. Even the so called experts are arguing, so who to believe and who not to believe is the truth of it.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2021 10:04:38 GMT
My understanding is this;
Vaccination provides good protection from the virus but doesn't stop you catching the virus and potentially passing it on.
The good news is that if a vaccinated person catches the virus their antibodies will kick in quickly to fight it (hence why the vaccine gives good protection), this also reduces the viral load that the infected and vaccinated person 'emits' outwards, hence reducing the chances of infecting others.
So everyone is sort of correct it just depends on what 'spin' you wish to put on it.
I'm in no doubt that vaccines work for protection from the worst effects of Covid, just how well they will stop the spread of the virus is still to be seen but I think early signs are quite good.
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Post by ianali on Apr 5, 2021 10:10:44 GMT
Because they donβt want it! Even if they need it? Phil well Iβd have thought itβs sensible to have it if needed. Shouldnβt be obligatory though, should it? Then obviously there are the many younger, healthy people who donβt need it as catching covid19 gives a relatively small risk of serious illness to them.
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Post by Clinton Cool on Apr 5, 2021 10:48:27 GMT
It's pleasing that folk are now (mostly) discussing the merits or otherwise of the vaccine potion in logical, reasonable ways. This is a far cry from the early days when anyone who openly shared any doubts about the vaccine, or stated that they wouldn't be having it (for any reason) was instantly branded an 'antivaxxer'. This should have been no surprise, there being organisations such as the BBC around, who promulgated this negative slogan at the earliest opportunity. This organisation claims to be liberally minded, of course, but in common with many modern day social liberal forces it only offers its liberalism towards those who agree with it. Otherwise it shows its true colours; left wing fascism.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2021 10:57:26 GMT
'potion'; 'left-wing fascism'; lol.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2021 10:58:23 GMT
possibly still not clear enough for someone who choses not to see ..... The problem is, lots of conflicting information. Even the so called experts are arguing, so who to believe and who not to believe is the truth of it. I disagree.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2021 10:59:39 GMT
Even if they need it? Phil Shouldnβt be obligatory though, should it? It isn't.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2021 11:18:09 GMT
Even if they need it? Phil well Iβd have thought itβs sensible to have it if needed. Shouldnβt be obligatory though, should it? Then obviously there are the many younger, healthy people who donβt need it as catching covid19 gives a relatively small risk of serious illness to them. No, it shouldnβt be obligatory, and although we are told itβs not, mission creep is setting in. They are looking to enforce the vaccine albeit without introducing statute. I rather suspect the number refusing the vaccine is significant and that is why the government are being so belligerent on it.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2021 11:22:11 GMT
well Iβd have thought itβs sensible to have it if needed. Shouldnβt be obligatory though, should it? Then obviously there are the many younger, healthy people who donβt need it as catching covid19 gives a relatively small risk of serious illness to them. No, it shouldnβt be obligatory, and although we are told itβs not, mission creep is setting in. They are looking to enforce the vaccine albeit without introducing statute. I rather suspect the number refusing the vaccine is significant and that is why the government are being so belligerent on it.Right wing fascism at play!
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2021 11:52:30 GMT
I like my immune system.
It's really clever. The other day I got bitten by a spider on my neck. Not sure which one it was but it has caused lymph nodes to swell up. I can see the white blood cells going and grabbing a sample of the poison, taking it to a strong-room and investigating it for future use.
Same sort of thing would happen with a virus. The body will in most cases deal with it.
Vaccination is appropriate for people who are unhealthy but for people in normal condition it seems to be the wrong approach. Surely much better to allow the body to learn about its enemies so that it can fight them off if they come back again.
And before anyone asks the obvious question if I were to get Covid and fall seriously ill (it won't happen) I would use private healthcare as by not having a vaccine I have personally opted out of Covid related NHS care.
For other things I can still use the NHS.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2021 12:05:33 GMT
Foxy, as regards a vaccination not stopping a person spreading the virus just stop and think (if you can) of how the virus spreads. Why do you think there is so much emphasis on washing regularly and carefully ? viral particles are everywhere, on handrails, balustrades,shop door handles, shopping trolley handles ...... everywhere where many people touch. When a person who is vaccinated comes in contact with those viral particles they pick them up on their hands/hair/clothing. Just because they have been vaccinated doesn't mean that the virus dies as soon as it touches their skin. It only protects them from becoming dangerously ill if the virus manages to infect them, although it reduces the risk of a mild infection (it takes a while before the antibodies get to work) That vaccinated person then goes into a shop and touches the door handle, the lift button, the shopping trolley handle ... and leaves some of those particles he has just picked up on the card reader buttons when he pays for his shopping.
That is how a virus is passed round vaccinations doesn't cause the virus to magically disintegrate as soon as it touches a vaccinated person, it doesn't give you superpowers it just helps prevent you catching it at mild levels, greatly prevents you becoming ill with it and stops you dying from it.
The way vaccinations prevent the spread of a disease is that it prevents a high proportion of people from catching it at all, which means a hell of a lot less people are leaving fresh viral particles for other people to pick up.
For God's sake grow up and start using some common sense ...... if you actually have any
My stance is that a lot of people are being had it is a comfort to see that I am not alone. Yes we know, and there are a great many utter twats in the world. They have a soap-box called the interweb.
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Post by Clinton Cool on Apr 5, 2021 12:18:01 GMT
well Iβd have thought itβs sensible to have it if needed. Shouldnβt be obligatory though, should it? Then obviously there are the many younger, healthy people who donβt need it as catching covid19 gives a relatively small risk of serious illness to them. No, it shouldnβt be obligatory, and although we are told itβs not, mission creep is setting in. They are looking to enforce the vaccine albeit without introducing statute. I rather suspect the number refusing the vaccine is significant and that is why the government are being so belligerent on it. Exactly. They start with 'soft' enforcement; the 'passport' only being required at a limited number of events, for a time limited period. These things enable the legislation to pass following a calculation of what will pass through the house, the maximum level of legislation without m.p.'s who value freedom voting it down. Next: The 'passports' are implemented. It's inevitable that in due course something will happen which will be used to justify an extension of the passports, a widening of the events/ actions for which they are required, or both. M.p's/ the public will have been 'softened up' by the initial implementation of the passport idea so it will be much easier to extend or broaden the scheme than it was to start it off. Doubtless, once introduced, socialist/ over cautious types who place little value on freedom will take up the chalice on behalf of the increasingly authoritarian government, using their considerable influence to silence anyone who doesn't agree with vaccine passports. And so, they will become established, and their scope will increase to such an extent that anyone who hasn't been injected with the vaccine potion will become a second class citizen. Doubt this? 'lockdown' was justified by the government on the basis of preventing the NHS from being overwhelmed. Nothing else. It was not overwhelmed, there is no risk of it being overwhelmed but 'lockdown' continues with the justification of reducing 'cases' and 'saving lives'. Significant mission creep, no doubt. The same will happen with 'vaccine passports'.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2021 12:23:53 GMT
14 diseases you almost forgot about conspiracies twats don't talk about because they've been hushed up by successful evil vaccination programmes perpetrated by sinister cabals of doctors and scientists.
1. Polio 2. Tetanus 3. Influenza 4. Hepatitis A 5. Hepatitis B 6. Rubella 7. Hib 8. Measles 9. Whooping Cough 10. Pneumococcal Disease 11. Rotavirus 12. Mumps 13. Chickenpox 14. Diphtheria
We're all doomed. Scientists eh, what a bunch of tossers. And smallpox. I mean, the world was getting along just fine dying of it by the millions before the bloody scientists came and cured it without so much as a 'by your leave'.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2021 13:28:12 GMT
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