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Post by patty on Jul 13, 2021 17:15:13 GMT
It is a strange twist of responsibility don't you think ? For example ... if I have a severe nut allergy, whilst food manufacturers must rightly display ingredients on packaging it must surely be my responsibility ultimately, to check , and if unsure to avoid any foods which do or may contain nuts. In the same way, if I have an immune system problem, or other health issue that may make the threat of a respiratory virus more severe, surely it is my responsibility to avoid any areas or environments I feel threatened by. Rog People have been protected so much that they are perhaps out of the habit of taking responsibility The population has now got to move on and assess their own risk It would be useful for those with auto immune disorders to know whether they have antibodies Without the full facts, informed choices cannot be successfully made. I know I have had a good response and have antibodies..I'm lucky being in the Twinny Research ...however I will still assess situations.
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Post by Telemachus on Jul 13, 2021 17:51:00 GMT
It is a strange twist of responsibility don't you think ? For example ... if I have a severe nut allergy, whilst food manufacturers must rightly display ingredients on packaging it must surely be my responsibility ultimately, to check , and if unsure to avoid any foods which do or may contain nuts. In the same way, if I have an immune system problem, or other health issue that may make the threat of a respiratory virus more severe, surely it is my responsibility to avoid any areas or environments I feel threatened by. Rog So what you saying is that people with compromised immunity or other health issues that make them high risk of death from COVID (and there are millions of them) can just stay at home, never go to the shops, the pub etc. And all so you don’t have to bother to wear a mask in an indoor public space. How very nice.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 13, 2021 18:08:20 GMT
Not at all ... just suggesting ultimate responsibility must surely rest with the individuals concerned. Whatever I do, I cannot guarantee safe public places for those at risk. Yet Jim seemed to be offering that view. Rog
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Post by Deleted on Jul 13, 2021 18:58:04 GMT
3 pages and no Fox, hope he is ok..
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Post by Clinton Cool on Jul 13, 2021 19:03:46 GMT
I think he's taking a short break? Don't worry, I'm sure he'll be back, with renewed vigour.
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Post by quaysider on Jul 14, 2021 6:53:00 GMT
All the way through this, whilst mask except due to my asthma, I've towed the line to peer pressure and worn one - under duress as I took the 'it's not the end of the world approach and I can tolerate it'.
NOW however (especially when it's burning hot) I can't tolerate it and have had enough. It makes NO sense when teenagers have been allowed not to wear them all along in shops etc. so WHAT is the point? If I'm wandering around tesco with a load of "yoofs" in there not wearing them the whole thing is pointless. SURE if I had a coughing fit I'd cover my mouth with my t-shirt etc but all this putting a mask on OUTSIDE to walk from a check in desk to another outside table in a pub is just bloody stupid.
Most of us are all double jabbed now... most of us have access to the testing kits (we do them before folks come on the boat and when they leave) - WHAT more can we do?
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Post by Deleted on Jul 14, 2021 7:14:46 GMT
I entirely agree quaysiderHowever, being polite and subservient by nature, I'll no doubt keep putting one on in shops and buses. I was arguing against the 'guilt trip' being applied by some, who are describing such actions as selfish . Rog
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Post by Jim on Jul 14, 2021 7:28:12 GMT
Not at all ... just suggesting ultimate responsibility must surely rest with the individuals concerned. Whatever I do, I cannot guarantee safe public places for those at risk. Yet Jim seemed to be offering that view. Rog Not at all, I'm saying we should do what we can, easily. No guarantees. Wearing a mask is such a simple and effective measure. What right does a carrier have to infect and possibly kill others? That is the nub of the issue.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 14, 2021 7:37:27 GMT
But you not demanding a carrier wears one ... you're demanding we all do, after the requirement to do so is lifted.
Rog
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Post by Jim on Jul 14, 2021 7:40:10 GMT
But you not demanding a carrier wears one ... you're demanding we all do, after the requirement to do so is lifted. Rog How do we know who the carriers are? I think it is wrong to lift the requirement.
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Post by Clinton Cool on Jul 14, 2021 7:43:20 GMT
All the way through this, whilst mask except due to my asthma, I've towed the line to peer pressure and worn one - under duress as I took the 'it's not the end of the world approach and I can tolerate it'. NOW however (especially when it's burning hot) I can't tolerate it and have had enough. It makes NO sense when teenagers have been allowed not to wear them all along in shops etc. so WHAT is the point? If I'm wandering around tesco with a load of "yoofs" in there not wearing them the whole thing is pointless. SURE if I had a coughing fit I'd cover my mouth with my t-shirt etc but all this putting a mask on OUTSIDE to walk from a check in desk to another outside table in a pub is just bloody stupid. Most of us are all double jabbed now... most of us have access to the testing kits (we do them before folks come on the boat and when they leave) - WHAT more can we do? I'm also an asthma sufferer and like you I've bowed to pressure and wear one when I go into shops. It's very unpleasant but, living in a small town as I do, it's easy to raise 'tut tut's' which spread around and before long your ostracised. If I was a bit younger I'd go ahead, confront the gossipers but I prefer an easy life as much as is possible. I don't think the likes of Jim realise the scale of this, the number of people who are oppressed in this, and similar ways.
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Post by Mr Stabby on Jul 14, 2021 7:44:33 GMT
I'm not going to wear one. I don't like them and bollocks to everybody else.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 14, 2021 7:46:02 GMT
But you not demanding a carrier wears one ... you're demanding we all do, after the requirement to do so is lifted. Rog How do we know who the carriers are? I think it is wrong to lift the requirement. I think masks have been utterly futile in public places (not in care and nursing obviously) and has merely resulted in them being littered around the country. But the mandatory wearing is being removed. The vaccination roll out is a greater protection than masks. Having said that, I'll still be wearing one where invited to do so out of simple compliance Rog
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Post by Jim on Jul 14, 2021 7:56:43 GMT
How do we know who the carriers are? I think it is wrong to lift the requirement. I think masks have been utterly futile in public places (not in care and nursing obviously) and has merely resulted in them being littered around the country. But the mandatory wearing is being removed. The vaccination roll out is a greater protection than masks. Having said that, I'll still be wearing one where invited to do so out of simple compliance Rog Evidence, there is lots more The science around the use of masks by the public to impede COVID-19 transmission is advancing rapidly. In this narrative review, we develop an analytical framework to examine mask usage, synthesizing the relevant literature to inform multiple areas: population impact, transmission characteristics, source control, wearer protection, sociological considerations, and implementation considerations. A primary route of transmission of COVID-19 is via respiratory particles, and it is known to be transmissible from presymptomatic, paucisymptomatic, and asymptomatic individuals. Reducing disease spread requires two things: limiting contacts of infected individuals via physical distancing and other measures and reducing the transmission probability per contact. The preponderance of evidence indicates that mask wearing reduces transmissibility per contact by reducing transmission of infected respiratory particles in both laboratory and clinical contexts. Public mask wearing is most effective at reducing spread of the virus when compliance is high. Given the current shortages of medical masks, we recommend the adoption of public cloth mask wearing, as an effective form of source control, in conjunction with existing hygiene, distancing, and contact tracing strategies. Because many respiratory particles become smaller due to evaporation, we recommend increasing focus on a previously overlooked aspect of mask usage: mask wearing by infectious people (“source control”) with benefits at the population level, rather than only mask wearing by susceptible people, such as health care workers, with focus on individual outcomes. We recommend that public officials and governments strongly encourage the use of widespread face masks in public, including the use of appropriate regulation www.pnas.org/content/118/4/e2014564118
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Post by ianali on Jul 14, 2021 7:57:14 GMT
Not at all ... just suggesting ultimate responsibility must surely rest with the individuals concerned. Whatever I do, I cannot guarantee safe public places for those at risk. Yet Jim seemed to be offering that view. Rog Not at all, I'm saying we should do what we can, easily. No guarantees. Wearing a mask is such a simple and effective measure. What right does a carrier have to infect and possibly kill others? That is the nub of the issue. So this means masks forever then?
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