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Post by Deleted on Oct 7, 2021 10:21:59 GMT
Good info Tony.
I did originally think it was straight out of the bottom but as you suggest this would be quite risky as the product ages.
I wonder if it has been blanked off on the hull outlet (perhaps sheathed over with GRP?) and the bucket of water previously mentioned is just sitting in the vertical tube part between toilet bowl and hull.
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Post by TonyDunkley on Oct 7, 2021 10:40:44 GMT
Good info Tony. I did originally think it was straight out of the bottom but as you suggest this would be quite risky as the product ages. I wonder if it has been blanked off on the hull outlet (perhaps sheathed over with GRP?) and the bucket of water previously mentioned is just sitting in the vertical tube part between toilet bowl and hull. Who knows, . . maybe that's why the previous owner didn't use the bog. The dump flap spindle is actually on the opposite side from the operating pedal, and there's an external counter-weight -- out of sight behind the bowl and column -- that swings the dump flap upwards and holds it closed. Neat tidy looking set-up, . . but it did make for extra wear inducing loadings on the operating spindle, bushings and seals. When there were a lot of these things about, they were known for being the only bogs fitted with a kick-starter.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 7, 2021 11:05:55 GMT
There was a bog called the "ballhead", which I think exited straight out of the hull.
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Post by JohnV on Oct 7, 2021 12:30:54 GMT
Ormeliteeve just out of interest as you were saying you are on The Great Ouse area, this Ormelite caught my eye when I was around that area in 2016
(oh Lord was it that long ago )
I was wondering if it was the one you have bought ? it was moored (if I remember right) near the junction of Brandon Creek and the main river
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Post by ormeliteeve on Oct 7, 2021 13:10:43 GMT
Ormeliteeve just out of interest as you were saying you are on The Great Ouse area, this Ormelite caught my eye when I was around that area in 2016
(oh Lord was it that long ago )
I was wondering if it was the one you have bought ? it was moored (if I remember right) near the junction of Brandon Creek and the main river
Yep, you’re correct, that’s the one! That cover has just been professionally repaired at a cost of £1000, the previous owner gave me the receipt. It’s not on the boat at the moment though, just tarps over winter while I wait to re-waterproof the repaired canvas cover.
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Post by JohnV on Oct 7, 2021 14:04:21 GMT
Ormeliteeve just out of interest as you were saying you are on The Great Ouse area, this Ormelite caught my eye when I was around that area in 2016
(oh Lord was it that long ago )
I was wondering if it was the one you have bought ? it was moored (if I remember right) near the junction of Brandon Creek and the main river
Yep, you’re correct, that’s the one! That cover has just been professionally repaired at a cost of £1000, the previous owner gave me the receipt. It’s not on the boat at the moment though, just tarps over winter while I wait to re-waterproof the repaired canvas cover. Well there you are .... a picture of your Ormelite ..... taken by a bloke in another Ormelite
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Post by ormeliteeve on Oct 7, 2021 16:46:43 GMT
I can't remember who the makers were, but I recognize that bog. They were a common fitting in hire boats, and discharged the bowl contents straight through an opening in the hull bottom, . . I've never seen one fitted to a holding tank, and I very much doubt there'll be one in this boat. All OK when newly installed, but depending on the height of the bog relative to the LWL, a potential source of leakage as they got older from wear on the pedal operated dump flap, or from a worn pedal spindle. The most serious risk of severe leakage arises from failure of the holding down through bolts that secure the whole thing in place through wastage, degradation or galvanic action -- depending on the material the bolts used were made from. The back leakage into the bowl via the dump flap can get to be quite serious in unusually rough water -- if the boat is pitching or rolling heavily, causing movement of the dump flap and water to be forced back up into or over the top of the bowl in the event of any debris preventing the flap from closing back onto its seating -- turbulence from filling locks can also occasionally result in some water getting into the boat through being forced back up into the bowl for the same reasons. Part or total failure of the through hull holding down bolts could send your boat to the bottom in a matter of minutes, . . with uncontrollable amounts of water coming in via the hull opening under the bog. I strongly advise arranging for slipping at the earliest possible opportunity to draw, inspect, and renew if necessary, all of those through hull holding down bolts. If the through hull joint is sound and watertight at present, there's no point in disturbing it, . . draw, inspect and replace each bolt singly, working diametrically from one to the next. Jeez, that wasn’t what I wanted to hear! I’m glad I know now though, thanks for your expertise. I was going to get it out in spring/summer for anti fouling and a general health check of below the waterline but sounds like that will be moving to the top of the priority list. I won’t touch the toilet any more until I get it out of the water, I definitely don’t want to take any risks of sinking/leaking in any way. I was hoping to leave it original but it’s sounding like a chemical toilet would help me sleep at night. It’s a pity because that one is so in-keeping with the boat but I’d rather have an unoriginal non-sunk boat.
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Post by kris on Oct 7, 2021 16:51:51 GMT
Tony knows nothing about toilets, unless it’s a bucket and Chuck it, his preferred method of disposal.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 7, 2021 17:18:06 GMT
On the contrary I suspect that the input from TonyDunkley in this thread is completely accurate. Anything fixed to the bottom of a boat with bolts is a risky area to disturb while boat is floating. ormeliteeve Presumably you would be able to open the flap in the bottom of the toilet, hold it open then drop a weight on a string down the hole. See how far it goes and if it's got river water or more undesirable products on it afterwards. That should deal with the question of if there is a tank. For some reason I had thought the boat was out of water but I see it isn't. This was why I suggested it might have been covered over - because otherwise the hole would be obvious if boat was out of water.. Not so with boat in water. It will be direct to river, no holding tank.
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Post by JohnV on Oct 7, 2021 17:32:50 GMT
from the picture there isn't enough distance under the floor for a tank. at the hull side the floor is only an inch or so above the chine.
I'll try and find some out of the water pictures to show you.
anything Tony says about boating is worth paying attention to especially with the older or traditional systems
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Post by Deleted on Oct 7, 2021 17:36:16 GMT
This is all getting a bit scatological.
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Post by JohnV on Oct 7, 2021 18:25:18 GMT
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Post by ormeliteeve on Oct 7, 2021 19:18:05 GMT
I completely believe everything Tony just said. His explanation of the system ties 100% with what I see and my logical reasoning of how it must work. I’m going to lift the toilet floor tomorrow to inspect the bolts from above for any serious weak spots/seepage. I want to anti foul it too so I’d rather wait until spring to slip it, it feels like a big risk now I know, whereas before I was in blissful ignorance. I’ll drop a plumb weight down there tomorrow just to check it’s not been blocked off, although I’m sure already that it hasn’t.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 7, 2021 19:21:18 GMT
You could drop a fishing line down there. If you pull out a fish, at least all is not lost.
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Post by ormeliteeve on Oct 7, 2021 19:25:17 GMT
JohnV,
Your ormelite is beautiful. I was wondering if you have a photo of the driving seat area you could show me please? Mine has a few planks of wood for the foot rest area but it doesn’t look original and in fact, someone has built the planks around the gear lever (which has a slot to move forwards and backwards) and so it’s impossibly to fold upwards like the flap on the bathroom side. I’d be interested to know what yours looks like so I can perhaps try to recreate it on mine. You also have a hinged flap bit beneath the steering wheel which I don’t have. What is that?
I hope my Eve can look as good as Shapfell, with a bit of time and a lot of hard work.
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