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Post by Deleted on Oct 9, 2021 17:00:59 GMT
I understand that winter weather makes the crossing very hit and miss, so rather than having bookings backing-up, it's simpler to close the link. I understand that has been the case since it opened in 2002. However, I have never done it and will probably never do it ... but I'll certainly never do it in winter as it's closed Rog
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Post by Deleted on Oct 9, 2021 17:03:25 GMT
I think anybody who refuses to transit the Ribble link in flood is a damned noddy boater.
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Post by TonyDunkley on Oct 9, 2021 17:13:27 GMT
Just agreeing with thebfg The Ribble link is closed until spring ... it does this every winter.Rog It doesn't close itself, . . does it ! If the tide lock onto the River Douglas at Tarleton, and the tide gate in the Savick Brook aren't available and open to navigation at tide time on every day of the year, as they both should be under C&RT's customary obligations as a navigation/harbour authority, then it's C&RT that's failing in its customary duty to provide passage through a tidal lock or through a tide gate under its sole control at all times when the state of the tide allows such passage.
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Post by TonyDunkley on Oct 9, 2021 17:40:29 GMT
I understand that winter weather makes the crossing very hit and miss, so rather than having bookings backing-up, it's simpler to close the link. Rog C&RT claptrap, . . aimed at the inexperienced, the unnecessarily nervous, and above all at the obsequiously gullible, and the incredibly stupid, . . and it obviously works rather well ! Weather, in all its variations and unpredictability, has no more or less effect on any passage, anywhere, on any river, tidal or non-tidal, irrespective of the season or time of year. If conditions are safe and suitable for the boat, AND the crew, . . then you go, . . if conditions aren't safe or suitable for the boat OR the crew, . . then you stay put.
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Post by thebfg on Oct 9, 2021 17:50:22 GMT
Just agreeing with thebfg The Ribble link is closed until spring ... it does this every winter.Rog It doesn't close itself, . . does it ! If the tide lock onto the River Douglas at Tarleton, and the tide gate in the Savick Brook aren't available and open to navigation at tide time on every day of the year, as they both should be under C&RT's customary obligations as a navigation/harbour authority, then it's C&RT that's failing in its customary duty to provide passage through a tidal lock or through a tide gate under its sole control at all times when the state of the tide allows such passage. in regards to the sea lock. Isn't it much easier to get to Preston marina and seek haven there. On the river wouldn't boaters seek help at Douglas marine?
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Post by Deleted on Oct 9, 2021 17:54:19 GMT
The Ribble link is closed for the winter ... it is closed every winter. I don't operate it ... I don't make the rules ... I don't even use it. I just know it's closed as thebfg has said. Rog ETA I believe the Liverpool link also closes for the winter even though some boats spend winter in the docks by arrangement (stranded because the link is closed until April)
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Post by JohnV on Oct 10, 2021 10:56:30 GMT
Closing or restricting tidal locks can in some cases be against the law (usually obscure and anciant regulations but still the law)
Many locks between tidal and non-tidal waters are classed as ports of refuge and as such have a legal obligation to allow entry to anyone needing a safe haven.
They are under no legal obligation to let you out again except at their times and under their terms.
So if either of those gates are so classed then there is a legal obligation to always allow access at suitable levels of tide.
Of course to get an authority to comply with a regulation that costs them a lot of money for no benefit to themselves would require an expensive action
Which means of course that unles it is a big commercial organisation that needs that access ...... it just ain't gonna happen ...... and another bit of freedom is chipped away.
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Post by thebfg on Oct 10, 2021 11:52:11 GMT
...... and another bit of freedom is chipped away. That depends if there is any law to support the theory that they need to be able to let boaters in. Crt only jointly own the link, my first guess is the locks are too new to be covered by some old law
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Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2021 11:56:09 GMT
The link opened in 2002 ... prior to that I assume you took your boat via lorry.
No freedom is chipped away in this instance.
Rog
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Post by JohnV on Oct 10, 2021 15:32:31 GMT
The link opened in 2002 ... prior to that I assume you took your boat via lorry. No freedom is chipped away in this instance. Rog But these aren't the only examples (and it's not just a CRT complaint) I know of three ports of refuge that have limited the access times by reducing the manning to daylight tide times only ..... only one is CRT controlled, I did say some entry points .... I don't know about the gates on the Ribble link
Mostly it's because of the dearth of commercial,navigation but sooner or later a private boater is going to be in trouble and need access, is not going to get it ...... and deaths could possibly result.
When you need access in an emergency you can guarantee that the weather will be grim, it'll be a big tide and the current will be roaring in/out and you'll be in deep doodoo
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Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2021 15:37:23 GMT
NigelMoore (they should put rip after some people's user names on the forum) did mention a few times the old Brentford tidal access gate which was replaced by BW with a full height concrete barrier. I'm not old or wise enough to remember it but I am pretty sure he was correct that the effect of doing this meant that BW could, in some people's view illegally, control transit between the tidal Thames and the partly tidal section of the Brent between Thames locks and the gauging locks. Intriguing situation.
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Post by JohnV on Oct 10, 2021 15:54:57 GMT
There is a question with access to the river Hull as the Harbour Master now only works daytime tides (Council Position)
Without doing a trip to research in the Museum, I am fairly certain that the Old Harbour of the River Hull is classed as a Port of Refuge. There are no lock gates but there are swing bridges. (on a very big tide Sabina needs them opening)
Above the old harbour there are many more bridges that need to be swung .... again an interesting legal position as bridge keepers, until very recently operated an hour before to two hours after every tide (although you did need to give 24 hours notice) and these are now only daytime tides and this waterway was granted a right of navigation back to Henry VIII day where river traffic has right of way over bridge use..
Without commercial interests being effected, it is very unlikely this will change, A cash strapped council is not going to take a blind bit of notice of private boaters without a legal ruling against them .... there is only a handful of larger private vessels that will have a problem (and to be honest no private boater is going to navigate the river Hull in the dark unless he is crazy and that certainly includes me)
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Post by peterboat on Oct 10, 2021 16:56:57 GMT
There is a question with access to the river Hull as the Harbour Master now only works daytime tides (Council Position) Without doing a trip to research in the Museum, I am fairly certain that the Old Harbour of the River Hull is classed as a Port of Refuge. There are no lock gates but there are swing bridges. (on a very big tide Sabina needs them opening) Above the old harbour there are many more bridges that need to be swung .... again an interesting legal position as bridge keepers, until very recently operated an hour before to two hours after every tide (although you did need to give 24 hours notice) and these are now only daytime tides and this waterway was granted a right of navigation back to Henry VIII day where river traffic has right of way over bridge use.. Without commercial interests being effected, it is very unlikely this will change, A cash strapped council is not going to take a blind bit of notice of private boaters without a legal ruling against them .... there is only a handful of larger private vessels that will have a problem (and to be honest no private boater is going to navigate the river Hull in the dark unless he is crazy and that certainly includes me) John only crazy people navigate the Ouse in the dark as the navigation lights are broken or covered by greenery!!!! Now remind which fools where playing in the dark on the Ouse?
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Post by faffer on Oct 10, 2021 18:22:56 GMT
I have had my plan for cruising this winter scuppered by long term winter stoppage near Gargrave, I am currently thinking about going on to the Ribble Link around Christmas, and pottering up and down the Lancaster. Is this a good plan? I tried to phone the N W Offices for some related advice today, as advised by the CRT website. Aparently the call centre don't release that number to the public (!!!!). Grrrrrr. Would I tell him what my query is, and what canal is the Ribble Link on. Now what advice can some person in a call centre give to myself, a stakeholder, the roles are reversed. It makes me so annoyed. As far as I can make out, as far as I am aware, The Ribble Link is the name of the navigation, but what is the point of the question, I wanted a phone number, he refused to give it me, end of query. Its a good idea as the Lanky is a great canal, bit shallow in places though that peed me off a lot. part the reason i jacked it in. So as the Ribble link is closed now untill next year, i know this as first hand experience as i needed a boat to et to the Lanky and asked them for help, and also a chap i sold a boat to last year had to wait till spring. One idea though is get it moved by road and dropped in at either Garstang marina or Bridge house marina next door. I guess you have a NB. I can give you a number if you want for a good priced company i have used a good few times. Have had my cruisers moved from Wigan to Garstang for less than £300. around 30 foot though. well wroth it at that price.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 10, 2021 18:39:28 GMT
A sensible length steel narrow boat won't go on the hiab truck so would suspect it might be more like a grand being crane/truck/crane rather than self contained gear.
Worth looking into though.
And as always happy to be wrong.
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