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Post by JohnV on Apr 19, 2016 13:05:09 GMT
You are right about previous situations and disputes not having a bearing on a situation but unfortunately they can. I don't know onionbargee apart from his posts but his posts suggest he has been "gaming" the system and judging from his loss of temper on the boards he quite possibly has introduced a personal element into the situation that has aggravated it. You are right that a professional should not have their judgement effected......but lets be honest....we all know it can be. What do you think John regarding the facts of the issue rather than the people involved? I get the feeling CRT are trying it on here. I have just spent an hour wading through the whole of the thread on CWDF.
There are three posts in particular that struck me. All of them concern the legal aspects of the case
they are all by Paul C and are posts #313 #321 and #332
If he is correct, and I do not have the legal background to be able to judge, then CRT are within their rights. The failure to return the monies paid does raise a question, unless of course, there were outstanding previous amounts owed to CRT.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2016 13:37:17 GMT
Got you John,the difference between Prior and Relevant Consent,I didn't think PaulC determined anything other than the fact it would have to be tested in court?
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Post by JohnV on Apr 19, 2016 13:47:34 GMT
yes but if it is the way CRT are thinking it would explain a lot. They could be well preparing on the basis that a judge will decide and that they believe they have a high chance of winning. It would certainly be of great benefit to them in dealing with others of the "awkward squad" in the future.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2016 14:26:03 GMT
yes but if it is the way CRT are thinking it would explain a lot. They could be well preparing on the basis that a judge will decide and that they believe they have a high chance of winning. It would certainly be of great benefit to them in dealing with others of the "awkward squad" in the future. Trouble is of course a court order can't over rule statute and thats why I believe Paul C has it wrong. The fact that CRT moved the issue onto one of Boat Safety backs that up in my opinion. I fear the Jenlyn of this parish possibly has it right when he lays it at the door of an obnoxious EO
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Post by kris on Apr 19, 2016 14:31:50 GMT
Personal grudges between boaters and enforcement officers. Along with unthinking support from management . Have led to some of the more questionable cases ending up in court. Although from what I hear, one of the most famous Mr garner from notts area has had to wind his neck in.
Regards kris
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2016 14:40:30 GMT
Personal grudges between boaters and enforcement officers. Along with unthinking support from management . Have led to some of the more questionable cases ending up in court. Although from what I hear, one of the most famous Mr garner from notts area has had to wind his neck in. Regards kris What do you think about this Prior and Relevant consent? CWDF posters get a bit pedantic over the details,had to smile at the Helicopter Pilot who could see no difference between CRT breaking the law and Onionbargee.
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Post by JohnV on Apr 19, 2016 14:53:57 GMT
The problem remains that only a judge can decide some of these points.....we can argue blacks white or wrangle till the cows come home but it doesn't matter a damn until the fat lady sings
(How's that for a load of metaphors in one post :-)
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2016 15:08:29 GMT
The problem remains that only a judge can decide some of these points.....we can argue blacks white or wrangle till the cows come home but it doesn't matter a damn until the fat lady sings (How's that for a load of metaphors in one post :-) You are right John,what is the up to date position regarding the situation? I take it wheels are turning towards a legal outcome or am I wrong, If its an EO mess up CRT have a lot of credibility to loose though to some posters on the other channel CRT can do anything and still remain beyond reproach. You would think people would tire of all this litigation,I would be telling staff make sure people adhere to the terms of their License,nothing more.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2016 15:08:40 GMT
The legislation is black and white. It's very clear on the needs for a licence to be issued. Onion bargee has satisfactorily met the "black and white" law to apply and receive a licence. The carry on trust are just attempting to work around it. They are wrong, onion bargee is right.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2016 15:12:15 GMT
The legislation is black and white. It's very clear on the needs for a licence to be issued. Onion bargee has satisfactorily met the "black and white" law to apply and receive a licence. The carry on trust are just attempting to work around it. They are wrong, onion bargee is right. I share your opinion,some of the comments on the other channel are laughable. What is the current state of play regarding seeking a resolution?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2016 15:16:36 GMT
I'm moored near him at the minute, just had a chat with him. He has no intention of giving up, and I fully support him. The law as it stands is on his side. I suspect the most ideal route is a judicial review, and if there was a need to crowdfund for that, I would be comfortable with donating to it.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2016 15:23:43 GMT
I'm moored near him at the minute, just had a chat with him. He has no intention of giving up, and I fully support him. The law as it stands is on his side. I suspect the most ideal route is a judicial review, and if there was a need to crowdfund for that, I would be comfortable with donating to it. So he is effectively trapped,I guess the ball is in his court,CRT have nothing to be urgent about. Put up or shut up or sell the boat which I hope he doesn't do,as I would rather he him try and fight the issue.
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Post by JohnV on Apr 19, 2016 15:34:25 GMT
I think the view I will stick with is I don't know who is right and who is wrong or both and to what degree. It will take something like a judicial review to settle it and until then I am going to stay ambivalent but with a strong suspicion that there is fault on both sides.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2016 15:34:26 GMT
CRT actually need to make the next move at the moment. Until they refund and refuse him the licence, there is little he can do. At this moment, he has a licence, and is entitled to use the waterways that licence covers. CRT need to get their act together, and swallow the poison they filled this particular chalice with. Or go for the fight.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2016 16:42:45 GMT
I think the view I will stick with is I don't know who is right and who is wrong or both and to what degree. It will take something like a judicial review to settle it and until then I am going to stay ambivalent but with a strong suspicion that there is fault on both sides. Well fair enough John,none of us want any grief,thats not what we boat for but its that climate of fear again and those that don't think it will affect them,I hope they have that right.
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