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Post by twbm2 on Apr 4, 2018 18:41:02 GMT
Someone has died at the hands of another. There is therefore grounds to suspect murder until the facts can be established to whatever extent is possible. Those facts are put before the CPS by the police, they decide what offence, if any, that the suspect should be charged with.
If you hit a burglar with the teapot that was the first thing you could lay your hands on and they die, it's probably manslaughter. If you go into the kitchen, select a knife then return to the burglar and stab him to death it's probably murder.
But a jury will decide, everything up to then is just administrative process.
There is no death penalty in the UK, ergo no offence can be serious enough to justify deliberate killing. Those that think it's OK to do that should seriously consider moving to a place where it would be tolerated so they can enjoy the rich vibrant experience of living under such regimes.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 4, 2018 18:50:36 GMT
If you hit a burglar with the teapot that was the first thing you could lay your hands on and they die, it's probably manslaughter. Agree with all your post other than the bit I've quoted. It could be self defence or several other reasons for it not to be considered a crime (after the relevant investigation).
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Post by Deleted on Apr 4, 2018 18:54:32 GMT
But
In the heat of the moment. You don't know what the person's intentions are. They could be there to kill you or your misses. They may be considerably stronger than you. Surely instinct takes over at some point ?
The police have a shoot to kill policy I believe because this is the only way to effectively neutralise a threat for example if someone is running about stabbing people in public.
Its not really comparable to the death penalty is it ?
Bit of an odd one the death penalty as it would apparently be voted in favour if a referendum took place but for some reason "they" don't think the plebs should have that choice.
Eta by that logic regarding seriousness of offence nobody should be killing anyone. If you want to do that then go and kill people in a country which condones killing people by using capital punishment.
The point is you do not know the intention of the individual. If they said "oh. Hello. I've just come to nick anything valuable then I'll be off" then maybe you could let them off but it seems improbable that this would happen.
I suppose the other side of it is that the police in fact know that the person killed was a serial burglar not a psycho axe murderer.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 4, 2018 19:02:58 GMT
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Post by Mr Stabby on Apr 4, 2018 19:06:46 GMT
If you hit a burglar with the teapot that was the first thing you could lay your hands on and they die, it's probably manslaughter. If you go into the kitchen, select a knife then return to the burglar and stab him to death it's probably murder. Not necessarily. www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-14248097
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Post by Deleted on Apr 4, 2018 19:07:35 GMT
That's interesting. Maybe the braindead Tory bastards would like to arrange another referendum/ plebiscite then ?
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Post by twbm2 on Apr 4, 2018 21:07:13 GMT
If you hit a burglar with the teapot that was the first thing you could lay your hands on and they die, it's probably manslaughter. If you go into the kitchen, select a knife then return to the burglar and stab him to death it's probably murder. Not necessarily. www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-14248097Yep. Hence 'probably'.
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Post by twbm2 on Apr 4, 2018 21:08:37 GMT
If you hit a burglar with the teapot that was the first thing you could lay your hands on and they die, it's probably manslaughter. Agree with all your post other than the bit I've quoted. It could be self defence or several other reasons for it not to be considered a crime (after the relevant investigation). Yep. Hence 'Probably'...
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Post by twbm2 on Apr 4, 2018 21:11:34 GMT
But In the heat of the moment. You don't know what the person's intentions are. They could be there to kill you or your misses. They may be considerably stronger than you. Surely instinct takes over at some point ? It does .. that would be the teapot, followed by Olympic standard running away, I think.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 4, 2018 21:13:56 GMT
Agree with all your post other than the bit I've quoted. It could be self defence or several other reasons for it not to be considered a crime (after the relevant investigation). Yep. Hence 'Probably'... If you had said possibly I would not have commented - probably denotes a judgement.
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Post by Mr Stabby on Apr 4, 2018 21:17:44 GMT
But In the heat of the moment. You don't know what the person's intentions are. They could be there to kill you or your misses. They may be considerably stronger than you. Surely instinct takes over at some point ? It does .. that would be the teapot, followed by Olympic standard running away, I think. As Kenny Rogers quite rightly pointed out "Sometimes you gotta fight when you're a man".
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Post by Stumpy on Apr 4, 2018 23:11:11 GMT
I was wondering if he had stabbed the intruder with the screwdriver which the intruder had apparently been carrying maybe it would have been more of a self defense thing. Or did he have a "that's not a knife - that's a knife" crocodile Dundee Bowie knife in the kitchen . BBC Quote: "One suspect, armed with a screwdriver, forced the man into his kitchen where a struggle ensued and he was stabbed, Scotland Yard said."
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Post by Stumpy on Apr 4, 2018 23:14:35 GMT
For some (like the war criminal B liar), death is too quick.
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Post by naughtyfox on Apr 5, 2018 4:14:16 GMT
But In the heat of the moment. You don't know what the person's intentions are. They could be there to kill you or your misses. They may be considerably stronger than you. Surely instinct takes over at some point ? It does .. that would be the teapot, followed by Olympic standard running away, I think. We have an axe under our bed, ready for my hand to grab it, so that would be the first thing in my hands for 'slaughter'. If I had to go and search for a teapot, that would be 'murder' by your logic.
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Post by JohnV on Apr 5, 2018 5:27:46 GMT
I have several Swedish fids of various sizes all over the boat, definitely the first thing to hand
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