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Post by naughtyfox on Sept 14, 2022 15:52:16 GMT
What are the bad points of this if its voluntary though? Social Credit System. Red on your phone from the Government means you can't go anywhere or do anything. Don't believe me? Catch a plane to China and ask the Chinese who are well and truly trapped in the nightmare of their own making. This "I have nothing to hide" is a nonsense - everyone has secrets. If not, why can't we have a camera in Liz Truss's toilet so we can see her having a poo?
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Post by naughtyfox on Sept 14, 2022 15:53:56 GMT
What are the bad points of this if its voluntary though?
It is dodgy. Once something becomes "normal" people will accept it as if it were voluntary just because other people are doing it. As we have witnessed - all the morons running off to the Grab-a-Jab Centre because SAGE and the NHS told them to. And wearing face masks in the pub and Lidl! And now pretending they didn't.
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Post by naughtyfox on Sept 14, 2022 15:56:24 GMT
As are we all. I thought contactless on the iPhone was great, then it became a bore pressing buttons first, then the Apple watch came and it was even easier, then the double click became a bore, so an implant where i just think 'pay' and present ones finger to a reader will make my life even easier. Death will make your life easier.
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Post by naughtyfox on Sept 14, 2022 15:59:48 GMT
There are still ways to send money though, paypal for example, send friends and family money for those beers they bought you down the pub, not the cash in hand work tony the marine engineer did. You think the Government/Police/GCHQ/China doesn't know what you sent via Paypal?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2022 16:50:33 GMT
Cashless society is just about more control. If there’s no cash, it stops people having value exchanges without the banks and taxman knowing. So when you get your mate the builder to do a little job for you he has to declare it. Its almost as if they are worried everything is going out of control. Cash doesn’t have the leverage it once had, discounts for cash with tradesmen are a thing of the past. Try buying a car for cash from a main dealership and expecting a hefty discount - you’ll be disappointed, money to be made on finance and up selling GAP insurance and paint protection - a rolled up bunch of £50s is a ball ache to bank and needs accounting fir due to money laundering rules. My brother runs his own heating, plumbing and electrical contracting firm, he hates having cash from customers. Mates rates and like for like deals with his fellow tradesmen are a different story.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2022 16:57:37 GMT
There are still ways to send money though, paypal for example, send friends and family money for those beers they bought you down the pub, not the cash in hand work tony the marine engineer did. ignoring the Tony element for a min. Any electronic cash is traceable, how did they buy you the beers down the pub? By card or phone so all traceable. People I know that have money are buying silver. S is okay but it has crashed badly this year. Check the graphs. Whether this a deliberate strategy to discourage a move towards it as a "safe investment" is open to debate but it has been quite badly hammered recently. Copper may be better but larger of course.
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Post by kris on Sept 14, 2022 17:07:34 GMT
Cashless society is just about more control. If there’s no cash, it stops people having value exchanges without the banks and taxman knowing. So when you get your mate the builder to do a little job for you he has to declare it. Its almost as if they are worried everything is going out of control. Cash doesn’t have the leverage it once had, discounts for cash with tradesmen are a thing of the past. Try buying a car for cash from a main dealership and expecting a hefty discount - you’ll be disappointed, money to be made on finance and up selling GAP insurance and paint protection - a rolled up bunch of £50s is a ball ache to bank and needs accounting fir due to money laundering rules. My brother runs his own heating, plumbing and electrical contracting firm, he hates having cash from customers. Mates rates and like for like deals with his fellow tradesmen are a different story. It’s not a bout discounts, it’s about untraceabilty. I just used the example of a tradesman, to illustrate the point. Let me try another example. You help me out as a friend, I want to show my gratitude. In a cashless society I have to do this electronically, hmrc are automatically made aware and you are taxed. The authorities are made aware and they investigate because it’s not a sanctioned transaction. Unfortunately we live during a time when technology has delivered the dictators dream of total surveillance and recording of every electronic communication and transaction. I’d rather go back to trading cowrie shells like the Polynesians. Half of the problems with the financial system is that money became disconnected from anything of intrinsic value. Cashless societies are just a continuation of that madness. What about if there’s a power outage and all of a sudden you can’t access you electronic wealth.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2022 17:08:31 GMT
Several places we have bought coffees/lunch time drinks etc from whilst we have been away in Cornwall the last couple of weeks have been 'card only'.
Small retailers selling stuff from trailers and the like.
When I enquired of one just why she responded 'cash is too much of a prat on'. Needs banking and before that ccounting up for accounting purposes etc etc.
Her little 'square' card reader did it all for her she said.
90% of the car parks we have used now take contactless or use the 'just park' app. linked to Google pay.
Cash is effectively dead, IMHO.
Personally Im not concerned about the associated privacy issues. If I was I wouldnt use loyalty cards, a mobile phone, Google smart speakers or Ring devices at home.
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Post by kris on Sept 14, 2022 17:09:59 GMT
ignoring the Tony element for a min. Any electronic cash is traceable, how did they buy you the beers down the pub? By card or phone so all traceable. People I know that have money are buying silver. S is okay but it has crashed badly this year. Check the graphs. Whether this a deliberate strategy to discourage a move towards it as a "safe investment" is open to debate but it has been quite badly hammered recently. Copper may be better but larger of course. Yes or lithium. How much has money devalued in the same time period.
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Post by kris on Sept 14, 2022 17:14:10 GMT
Several places we have bought coffees/lunch time drinks etc from whilst we have been away in Cornwall the last couple of weeks have been 'card only'. Small retailers selling stuff from trailers and the like. When I enquired of one just why she responded 'cash is too much of a prat on'. Needs banking and before that ccounting up for accounting purposes etc etc. Her little 'square' card reader did it all for her she said. 90% of the car parks we have used now take contactless or use the 'just park' app. linked to Google pay. Cash is effectively dead, IMHO. Personally Im not concerned about the associated privacy issues. If I was I wouldnt use loyalty cards, a mobile phone, Google smart speakers or Ring devices at home. That’s all personal choice, but if cash is got rid of your removing the choice to use it.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2022 17:19:58 GMT
Several places we have bought coffees/lunch time drinks etc from whilst we have been away in Cornwall the last couple of weeks have been 'card only'. Small retailers selling stuff from trailers and the like. When I enquired of one just why she responded 'cash is too much of a prat on'. Needs banking and before that ccounting up for accounting purposes etc etc. Her little 'square' card reader did it all for her she said. 90% of the car parks we have used now take contactless or use the 'just park' app. linked to Google pay. Cash is effectively dead, IMHO. Personally Im not concerned about the associated privacy issues. If I was I wouldnt use loyalty cards, a mobile phone, Google smart speakers or Ring devices at home. That’s all personal choice, but if cash is got rid of your removing the choice to use it. Indeed, I am surprised that some (small) businesses choose to lose trade rather than accept cash as Im sure there must be people who wont buy from 'card only' retailers on principle.
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Post by naughtyfox on Sept 14, 2022 17:22:20 GMT
ignoring the Tony element for a min. Any electronic cash is traceable, how did they buy you the beers down the pub? By card or phone so all traceable. People I know that have money are buying silver. S is okay but it has crashed badly this year. Check the graphs. Whether this a deliberate strategy to discourage a move towards it as a "safe investment" is open to debate but it has been quite badly hammered recently. Copper may be better but larger of course. Invest in 'Covid vaccines'. There are enough mugs clamoring for 'em! Grab a Jab and get myocarditis ... to 'Save Others'.
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Post by naughtyfox on Sept 14, 2022 17:26:51 GMT
Cash doesn’t have the leverage it once had, discounts for cash with tradesmen are a thing of the past. Try buying a car for cash from a main dealership and expecting a hefty discount - you’ll be disappointed, money to be made on finance and up selling GAP insurance and paint protection - a rolled up bunch of £50s is a ball ache to bank and needs accounting fir due to money laundering rules. My brother runs his own heating, plumbing and electrical contracting firm, he hates having cash from customers. Mates rates and like for like deals with his fellow tradesmen are a different story. It’s not a bout discounts, it’s about untraceabilty. I just used the example of a tradesman, to illustrate the point. Let me try another example. You help me out as a friend, I want to show my gratitude. In a cashless society I have to do this electronically, hmrc are automatically made aware and you are taxed. The authorities are made aware and they investigate because it’s not a sanctioned transaction. Unfortunately we live during a time when technology has delivered the dictators dream of total surveillance and recording of every electronic communication and transaction. I’d rather go back to trading cowrie shells like the Polynesians. Half of the problems with the financial system is that money became disconnected from anything of intrinsic value. Cashless societies are just a continuation of that madness. What about if there’s a power outage and all of a sudden you can’t access you electronic wealth. I agree with you on this. Unfortunately you will be called a 'conspiracy theorist' and 'anti-cashless-society' or suchlike, and jokes will be made about your tin foil hat. When it becomes true, 'thebfg' - after calling you a nutter - will say "Anybody could have predicted it." Anyone died of 'the pandemic' yet? Come on, hurry up! Yeah, yeah, I know: "The vaccines saved us all!" Idiots.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2022 17:28:57 GMT
Cash doesn’t have the leverage it once had, discounts for cash with tradesmen are a thing of the past. Try buying a car for cash from a main dealership and expecting a hefty discount - you’ll be disappointed, money to be made on finance and up selling GAP insurance and paint protection - a rolled up bunch of £50s is a ball ache to bank and needs accounting fir due to money laundering rules. My brother runs his own heating, plumbing and electrical contracting firm, he hates having cash from customers. Mates rates and like for like deals with his fellow tradesmen are a different story. It’s not a bout discounts, it’s about untraceabilty. I just used the example of a tradesman, to illustrate the point. Let me try another example. You help me out as a friend, I want to show my gratitude. In a cashless society I have to do this electronically, hmrc are automatically made aware and you are taxed. The authorities are made aware and they investigate because it’s not a sanctioned transaction. Unfortunately we live during a time when technology has delivered the dictators dream of total surveillance and recording of every electronic communication and transaction. I’d rather go back to trading cowrie shells like the Polynesians. Half of the problems with the financial system is that money became disconnected from anything of intrinsic value. Cashless societies are just a continuation of that madness. What about if there’s a power outage and all of a sudden you can’t access you electronic wealth. Traceability and flying under the radar are things that can’t coexist - as Martin points out, you need to get shot of yer phone and any online presence. I would love to wind the clock back 20+ years to the pre connected era when a phone had a string on it and a pub wouldn’t let you buy beer with plastic. The genie is out the lamp and can’t be put back in.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2022 17:35:13 GMT
That’s all personal choice, but if cash is got rid of your removing the choice to use it. Indeed, I am surprised that some (small) businesses choose to lose trade rather than accept cash as Im sure there must be people who wont buy from 'card only' retailers on principle. Except they won’t be losing trade - I can’t imagine anyone saying ‘Fuck this Mabel, no cash no sale, stick yer car park at a given beauty spot up your arse’ almost everyone taps away, the days of having a wedge to go on holiday are long gone. Ive had £20 in my phone case for a couple of months now and never ever find the need to use it. The downside to cashless society is spending habits while drinking - once upon a time when you ran out of cash you had to search out an ATM to get more and continue the night. Now, as long as you have your card, phone or watch the sky (or indeed the gutter!) is the limit, well until at least you get declined by the bank and by then the beers have been poured anyway!
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