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Post by NigelMoore on Nov 9, 2016 19:11:27 GMT
Just checked – I got it wrong; it is 24 consecutive hours in any 48. www.richmond.gov.uk/sealed_mooring_byelaws.pdfThe above lists all the relevant sites to which the byelaws apply. Further particulars – Confirmation of Mooring ByelawsOn Thursday 12 February 2015 the Council received confirmation from the Secretary of State that the Byelaw outlined below will come into force one calander month after the date of confirmation. From 13 March 2015 a criminal offence will be committed if any vessel is moored for longer than permitted without the written consent of the Council. The details of the restrictions are detailed in the documents below. The offences associated with this byelaw are criminal offences which are punishable upon summary conviction with a maximum fine of £500 per contravention. Both the owner and the master of a vessel may be prosecuted. • Byelaws Relating to Mooring (pdf, 1624KB) (excluding maps) • Mooring Byelaws Borough-wide Plan (pdf, 467KB) • Mooring Byelaws Detailed Plan 1 to 6 (pdf, 1586KB) • Mooring Byelaws Detailed Plan 7 to 12 (pdf, 2301KB) • Mooring Byelaws Detailed Plan 13 to 18 (pdf, 2287KB) • Mooring Byelaws Detailed Plan 19 to 24 (pdf, 1913KB) • Mooring Byelaws Detailed Plan 25 to 30 (pdf, 2414KB) • Mooring Byelaws Detailed Plan 31 to 37 (pdf, 2779KB) Full details, historic and current, from which above is copied: - www.richmond.gov.uk/byelaws_and_local_legislation
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Post by erivers on Nov 10, 2016 11:00:36 GMT
The Richmond byelaws do seem clear if Draconian.
However, there appears a growing trend on the Thames to limit visitor mooring and impose civil 'penalties' for overstaying or returning within a set period, including those owned by the Environment Agency.
In terms of the EA moorings, I doubt that some of terms and conditions particularly regarding overnight stays (including those shown on the Thames Visitor Moorings website - thamesvisitormoorings.co.uk ) - are enforceable or have any basis in law given Section 136 of the Thames Conservancy Act:
Thames Conservancy Act 1932 – Section 136 (b) Mooring charges. 136. The Conservators may from time to time demand and receive in respect of vessels using any of the moorings in the Thames belonging to the Conservators the charges appointed by byelaws of the Conservators for the time being in force save that no charge shall be made for vessels tied up or moored at night or for a reasonable time when not at work unless the traffic of the Thames is thereby impeded.
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Post by NigelMoore on Nov 10, 2016 12:03:20 GMT
In terms of the EA moorings, I doubt that some of terms and conditions particularly regarding overnight stays (including those shown on the Thames Visitor Moorings website - thamesvisitormoorings.co.uk ) - are enforceable or have any basis in law given Section 136 of the Thames Conservancy Act: Not only that, but even where/when they can legitimately levy a charge, they are supposed to enshrine the levels of those charges in a byelaw. Has anything more recent been passed in that respect?
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Post by NigelMoore on Nov 10, 2016 12:06:36 GMT
"A landmark judgement today (8 November 2016) at Kingston County Court confirmed that the navigation licence fee payable by boat owners relates only to the right to pass along the River Thames, including anchoring or mooring for a reasonable time to facilitate passage. It gives no right to long term or permanent mooring." [My bold]
As an example of how twisted a small-time judge can get things – this presupposes that the report above is accurate of course – what is said there runs directly counter even to what the EA argued! In the first place, there is no such thing as an EA licence for the Thames; as with the CaRT scheduled rivers, because of the PRN there are only pleasure boat certificates of registration, with all the implication that the differing vocabulary conveys. This is one area where the EA barrister got things exactly right. An element of the Trotman argument ran that as his boat was registered, the EA was not entitled to renege on the “permission” they had thereby given him to both “use” the river, and to “keep” his boat thereon. The EA response is one Leigh Ravenscroft has cited in his pleadings in his CaRT case: - “The payment of the licence [sic] fee is a legal requirement under the Environment Agency‘s (Inland Waterways) Order 2010 and does not confer a right to be on the River Thames, such right being derived from the non-tidal public right of navigation pursuant to s.79 Thames Conservancy Act 1932.” [my bold] I had hoped to have a published judgment agreeing with the EA point, but if the account above is correct, she messed that up comprehensively.
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Post by NigelMoore on Nov 10, 2016 12:21:23 GMT
My mind is asking what recourse do EA have to enforce the reasonable mooring time rule/statute. Now if it is a statute that suggests to my mind there should be an enforcement clause in the statutes. The Thames Conservancy Act 1932, s.79 provides: “ (2) The right of navigation in this section described shall be deemed to include a right to anchor moor or remain stationary for a reasonable time in the ordinary course of pleasure navigation subject to such restrictions as the Conservators may from time to time by byelaws determine and the Conservators shall make special regulations for the prevention of annoyance to any occupier of a riparian residence by reason of the loitering or delay of any house-boat or launch and for the prevention of the pollution of the Thames by the sewage of any house-boat or launch”. [my emphasis] That all reads so clearly pertinent to the case. It would appear, however [without my checking it out just now], that neither the Conservators nor their successors have ever created the necessary byelaws to comply with this provision. If they had, then the solution to the Trotman situation would have been to prosecute for the offence. Instead, the EA relied in their argument on s.79(2) immediately following the section of that I have quoted, which reserved the rights of private riparian land owners to take their own actions for trespass! [This section alone calls into question the legality of the Land Registration of the riverbed to the EA, but this is not the topic I want to pursue here and now. The clause above suffices to demonstrate in my opinion, that there was a clear distinction to be drawn between the common law rights of private owners, and the steps the Conservancy needed to take to acquire similar powers.] The July EA Skeleton moved on from its February version. In reliance on their dubious registration of the riverbed, they claimed: “ It would be illogical that the Claimant can own land [which they can of course] , but cannot take any action in respect of protecting the land from trespass or adverse possession, for example.” What that completely ignores, is that express provision for acquisition of any necessary powers was granted to them, regardless of whether they owned land or not! The argument that I cannot now find in either of those Skeletons, which I am sure I read in some of their submissions [it may just have been within pre-trial correspondence between the PLA solicitors and Alistair], was, on the other hand, also very much to the point respecting already existing powers. I find it so strange why they did not use them: Under the 1932 Act, for the purpose of conferring powers on the Conservators for regulating navigation etc, the provisions of the 1847 Harbours Act were incorporated “ and shall apply to the Thames as if the Thames were a harbour by this Act authorised . . .” Hence, s.82 provided that “The Conservators may from time to time by resolution under common seal authorise any one or more of their officers to assist any harbour-master in the exercise of his duties or may authorise any such officer to exercise alone all or any of the powers contained in the provisions of this Act relating to harbour-masters and those provisions shall be read as if the expression “harbour-master” wherever therein appearing included any officer so authorised.” The powers involved, as instantly relevant, were: s.83 " Any harbour-master may give directions for all or any of the following purposes (namely) :- For regulating the time and manner in which any vessel shall enter into go out of or lie in the Thames and the position mooring or unmooring placing or removing of any vessel within the Thames;” s.84 provided for a daily fine of £5 for failure to comply with the harbour-master’s directions; s.85 provided further that in continued breach “ such harbour-master may cause such vessel to be moored unmoored place or removed according to the directions aforesaid and employ a sufficient number of persons for that purpose and the expenses thereby incurred shall be paid by such master [of the vessel] and may be recovered summarily as a civil debt or as a debt in any court of competent jurisdiction.” Job done, I would have thought? I suspect that they did not wish to go that route because the onus would have been on them to find somewhere to move the boats to. But they are going to have to oversee and escort the boats a bit further on now anyway.
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Post by erivers on Nov 10, 2016 12:30:09 GMT
In terms of the EA moorings, I doubt that some of terms and conditions particularly regarding overnight stays (including those shown on the Thames Visitor Moorings website - thamesvisitormoorings.co.uk ) - are enforceable or have any basis in law given Section 136 of the Thames Conservancy Act: Not only that, but even where/when they can legitimately levy a charge, they are supposed to enshrine the levels of those charges in a byelaw. Has anything more recent been passed in that respect? The current Thames byelaws are "The Thames Navigation Byelaws 1993" so pre-date the Environment Agency which has seemed reluctant to use the powers afforded it to create byelaws for a variety of purposes by the 1932 Act. As an aside, recent posts on another forum suggest that the EA has virtually given up with enforcement of byelaws, including those designed to ensure safety, in favour of only enforcing against the 2010 IWO 'revenue producing' offences. YBW Thames ForumAs far as I am aware, in respect of mooring, the only relevant Thames Byelaw is 57, with the penalties defined at 85: Thames Byelaw 57 Mooring, anchoring and vessels attached to moorings 57 (a)The master or person in charge of any houseboat or launch who causes that houseboat or launch to be anchored moored or remain stationary during the course of ordinary navigation shall ensure that no annoyance be caused to any occupier of a riparian residence by reason of the loitering or delay of that houseboat or launch. (b) The master of any power-driven vessel attached to any moorings mooring buoy mooring post dolphin jetty wharf or landing-place shall ensure that her engines are not worked in a manner risking causing injury or damage to such moorings mooring buoy mooring post dolphin jetty wharf or landing-place or any vessel or thing whatsoever or in such manner to give reasonable cause for annoyance to any person on the waterway or on the banks. Penalties 85 (a) Any person who shall offend against any of these Byelaws shall for every offence be liable to a penalty not exceeding: (i) in the case of offences against Byelaws numbered 5 to 23, 25 to 27, 29 to 60, 62 to 75, 77, 78, 82, 84 and 85, level 3 on the Standard Scale; (ii) in any other cases, level 2 on the Standard Scale and in the case of a continuing offence to a further daily penalty not exceeding £10 (ten pounds) which said penalties shall be recoverable enforced and applied according to the provisions of the Acts. (b) Where any offence against these Byelaws is committed in respect of any vessel the person in charge and the owner of the vessel shall be liable to be proceeded against and punished provided that the person in charge and the owner of the vessel be not both punished in respect of the same offence.
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Post by NigelMoore on Nov 10, 2016 13:24:09 GMT
It is a very sad reflection on the perceived imperatives and priorities of the navigation authorities. When the provisions are there for them to accomplish what is necessary lawfully, it is absurd to take any other course; it just has to derive from something other than acting only in pecuniary interests surely? There were none involved in moving Trotman on after all; if anything, they are going to lose out on his registration fees.
I had almost forgotten the YBW Forum; it is a long time since I posted there, last time was over the first Wingfield kerfuffle. Must go look again.
edit to add: looked just now and see that this thread has been linked to!
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Post by NigelMoore on Nov 10, 2016 13:59:55 GMT
The EA itself has issued a brief commentary on the outcome, concluding:
“The Judge ruled that Mr Trotman had the right to own a boat and navigate on the non-tidal Thames, but that the registration fee he is required to pay to keep a boat on the river, does not include the right to moor indefinitely in one location against the landowners’ wishes. This confirms our view and is consistent with the advice we give to members of the public.”
They have made much of the fact that they are landowners, without clarifying whether that includes the banks or is just the riverbed. The fact is that the wording conveys any meaning ONLY if it applies to the riverbed – because the PRN gives NO right to access the riverbank even momentarily.
Otherwise, the statement is unexceptional.
The wording could be better though – “the registration fee he is required to pay to keep a boat on the river” is not strictly correct. You do not have to pay “to keep a boat on the river”; if you “keep a boat on the river”, you are required to pay for registration. The difference is not that subtle that their lawyers could not grasp that.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2016 14:22:02 GMT
It is a very sad reflection on the perceived imperatives and priorities of the navigation authorities. When the provisions are there for them to accomplish what is necessary lawfully, it is absurd to take any other course; it just has to derive from something other than acting only in pecuniary interests surely? There were none involved in moving Trotman on after all; if anything, they are going to lose out on his registration fees. I had almost forgotten the YBW Forum; it is a long time since I posted there, last time was over the first Wingfield kerfuffle. Must go look again. edit to add: looked just now and see that this thread has been linked to! Yes - I put it on ybw Thames forum as someone recently asked about one of the boats being below (not above) Molesey Lock. Thames Forum is currently very quiet but I saw no harm in linking to this thread as in the past people have been interested to know what's happening.
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Post by NigelMoore on Nov 10, 2016 17:50:39 GMT
I saw no harm in linking to this thread as in the past people have been interested to know what's happening. Indeed not; more the merrier. Two sites were affected: above Teddington Lock, and alongside Hurst Park.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2016 17:57:36 GMT
Yes I passed the boats several times this year and over the last 8 or so years I have noticed them as a very obvious feature of the lower part of the non tidal Thames.
The whole thing is an intriguing story. In a way I quite like the return to "Houseboating" on the River but these boats, while perhaps being a little reminiscent of the old days, were a bit too "shanty" in appearance and bound to draw attention.
I used to go down in my dinghy to Teddington Lock from Hampton Wick (where I lived) in the 80s very regularly and there was only one or two boats on the mooring above the lock cut.
Things have changed dramatically in the last 30 or so years. I would like to see more residential moorings constructed on the River as I like boats but I doubt it will happen.
Was very glad to find that I am allowed to stop the night at Ham - that is a Good Thing as far as I am concerned.
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Post by NigelMoore on Nov 10, 2016 18:02:24 GMT
As a matter of slightly related interest, my first contact with Alistair Trotman was while he was in Brentford building what was then his latest establishment below the Thames Locks, in April 2014. The Brentford Dock Estates agents complained to CaRT, asking them to move it away from their frontage, so the idiot Patrol Officer s.8’d it! There was a whole thread of really interesting stuff I posted up on CWDF at the time , prompted in part by that extraordinary knowing criminal behaviour, approved by the very spokesman who published their acknowledgement that they would have to start treating this section differently [Jon Guest I think?].
I still regret not copying that material, because the thread vanished without trace for the usual unstated reasons.
edit to add: Yes – the press release came from Fran Read issued on 15 February 2013, quoting Jon Guest saying that “as a result of this Judgement [sic], we will need to look at how we treat this stretch differently.”
He was [is?] the London Waterway Manager, and personally refused to allow ‘Kupe’ through the lock only a year later.
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Post by NigelMoore on Nov 11, 2016 10:25:43 GMT
. . . the real point of law is whether a statutory body can exercise those common law rights in the absence of express grant from the Parliament that gave them birth. For the benefit of those who will understandably not wish to take my word for it, respecting the limitation on Statutory bodies, and who do not have the time or inclination to trawl back through all the CWDF posts I have made on the subject, a law firm article that was recently drawn to my attention, neatly encapsulates the general position in law. Analysing the impact on local authorities of the Localism Act 2011, the author explains why the very first section of this Act was considered necessary [it gives a limited power to local authorities [which are creatures of statute], to act as a natural person]. She writes: “ Traditionally, while an individual may do anything that is not prohibited by law, the opposite is true for public bodies: they can only do what they have been authorised to by law. Any act or decision that goes beyond those powers is unlawful (or ‘ultra vires’).
Section 1(1) of the Localism Act 2011 (LA 2011) gives local authorities (LAs) the power to do anything that individuals may do – a ‘general power of competence’ (GPC). The GPC, therefore, reverses the presumption that any decision will be unlawful unless expressly permitted, and allows LAs to conduct their affairs with a greater degree of flexibility, providing them with new opportunities.” [my bold] www.bwbllp.com/file/p-r-spring-2015-general-power-of-competence-article-pdfIt follows, given that no such empowerment has been granted to the EA [or CaRT, or any statutory bodies other than local authorities], that bringing the action that the EA did, in reliance only on the assumed rights of a natural person, was ultra vires.
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Post by peterboat on Nov 23, 2016 17:08:04 GMT
Has the judge ruled on this today? it looks as though she has on the other channel and EA have won the case
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Post by tomsk on Nov 23, 2016 18:08:40 GMT
Pretty much OT but I lived in Kingston as a lad between '62 and '66 and many days during school holidays and many weekends were spent 'helping' the lockie at Teddington. I got very fit spinning those big white wheels. Same here but living in Twickenham and 15 years later
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