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Post by Deleted on Aug 12, 2019 13:31:36 GMT
I understood from your description of events Telemachus that you and the accompanying boat DID do the flight unaided, but were shouted at to 'Stop' in an officious way at one lock by a volocky. Have I misunderstood, and the volockies forced themselves upon you even though you said no thanks ? Rog
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Post by patty on Aug 12, 2019 13:47:29 GMT
storm in teacup springs to mind.. if someone has come on here to praise the Wigan flight based on their experience what does it matter? it does not detract from the complaint just proves that we all have different experiences.
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Post by Telemachus on Aug 12, 2019 14:01:31 GMT
I understood from your description of events Telemachus that you and the accompanying boat DID do the flight unaided, but were shouted at to 'Stop' in an officious way at one lock by a volocky. Have I misunderstood, and the volockies forced themselves upon you even though you said no thanks ? Rog The volockies forced themselves upon me only to the extent that they issued an inappropriate command to me at a relatively critical time. Then they tried to make a point by deciding not to help the Lady in the other boat who was struggling to close the gate on her own, smirking at me the while. No problem because I directed Jeff’s dad (who is a bit oblivious to things and was being distracted by the volockies) to help her. Whereupon the volockies pretty much pushed him out of the way (I didn’t see this but Jeff did) and closed the gate with a great Hooha just before Jeff arrived and would have been able to see that the gate was only marginally stiffer than the others. You had to be there to see the body language. Add to this the statement from Leyther that one was standing between the nearly open gate’s balance beam and the edge - if true, reckless and stupid in the extreme. And then the body language when they kept us waiting 15 mins after official “opening time” to let us out at the top in the pissing rain, carrying out the actions at the slowest possible pace just so we were quite clear who held the power. It all adds up to a bunch of self important guys who are at pains to make sure everyone knows just how important and clever they are. We thoroughly enjoyed every other aspect of traversing that flight, it was only the encounters with the volockies that cast a shadow. I sort of agree with you that as a one-off this isn’t a huge deal. The problem is that it is spreading around the system like a virus and needs to be stopped before it becomes the accepted norm.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 12, 2019 14:08:50 GMT
There's no doubt you have a justifiable complaint, and obviously don't need me to say so, I was rather suggesting it is possible to do the flight without assistance (albeit within the time frame C&RT have set).
Rog
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Post by thebfg on Aug 12, 2019 17:51:54 GMT
I imagine they were asked to join and put in a good word. I don't see a problem with that as it seems in the circumstances they were very well served? Anything thay brings in new members is a good thing. If they hang around that is.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 12, 2019 18:06:14 GMT
There's no doubt you have a justifiable complaint, and obviously don't need me to say so, I was rather suggesting it is possible to do the flight without assistance (albeit within the time frame C&RT have set). Rog Its a thin end of wedge thing really isn't it. I have mentioned the dumbing down issue before on this subject as has Telemachus. It is a mistake to misunderestimate the power that dumbing down can have. I'm sure it makes Telemachus glad he has no children because if the future involves nannying people in all of these sorts of situations then its going to lead to massive idiocy problems long term. Its not the end of the world but its quite sad.
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Post by JohnV on Aug 12, 2019 18:21:42 GMT
There's no doubt you have a justifiable complaint, and obviously don't need me to say so, I was rather suggesting it is possible to do the flight without assistance (albeit within the time frame C&RT have set).Rog that is another thing ..... as I said in my post earlier, I enjoyed doing the locks. I enjoyed doing the Wigan Flight at my speed which is now not possible thanks to the times set by the idiots in charge If I do that flight now I will be chivvied through with the aid of a pack of busybodies who are sucking the enjoyment out of my boating
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Post by Deleted on Aug 12, 2019 18:22:20 GMT
We arrived at the top of Napton flight and stopped to water up.
Almost immediately five boats arrived to go down, the second being a Napton hire boat with a young family.
The first boat went into the lock, but the young family remained at their boat, despite Jane suggesting to the lady that she may want to take a windlass to the lock.
Eventually the third boat owner told them they must go and turn the lock, or he would be taking it.
I think many new boaters are hesitant and nervous and NEED to be told what to do and when by someone who knows.
I liked the volockie we met at Hillmorton last week ... Jane commented that it was unusual to see one working alone there, to which he replied "I like to be alone, I'm a grumpy bastard."
Rog
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Post by Telemachus on Aug 12, 2019 18:28:28 GMT
We arrived at the top of Napton flight and stopped to water up. Almost immediately five boats arrived to go down, the second being a Napton hire boat with a young family. The first boat went into the lock, but the young family remained at their boat, despite Jane suggesting to the lady that she may want to take a windlass to the lock. Eventually the third boat owner told them they must go and turn the lock, or he would be taking it. I think many new boaters are hesitant and nervous and NEED to be told what to do and when by someone who knows. I liked the volockie we met at Hillmorton last week ... Jane commented that it was unusual to see one working alone there, to which he replied "I like to be alone, I'm a grumpy bastard." Rog In my view it would be better if CRT required the hire boaters received adequate training from the hire company, including going through a lock. Which of course some companies do, but some don’t. In any case, as I said I have no problem with volockies being available if required. But some tend to suffer from mission creep. I’m reminded of the volockies we encountered at one of the mechanised locks on the C&H bit of the A&C (near Stanley Ferry). They were perfectly pleasant and operated the lock for us. Apparently there are only volockies there on a Wednesday, and it was a Wednesday. But really, did we need some bods to press the buttons on the lock pedestal? Jeff was looking forward to it! They do other stuff such as light maintenance, and I suppose their reward is getting to press the buttons on a big lock. But at our expense!
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Post by Deleted on Aug 12, 2019 18:29:01 GMT
Of course the opening times are at the behest of C&RT management ... same as on the K&A and the GU. You can't really blame the volockies for implementing that judgement JohnVRog
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Post by Telemachus on Aug 12, 2019 18:31:39 GMT
Of course the opening times are at the behest of C&RT management ... same as on the K&A and the GU. You can't really blame the volockies for implementing that judgement JohnV Rog L&L had severe restrictions due to water supply. Fair enough. Then it rained a lot and all restrictions were lifted. Then the next day they said “Oh, we didn’t mean Wigan, it’s restrictions are an anti-vandal measure”. If I were a gambling man I would put money in the WFC volockies having lobbied CRT Wigan to reinstate the “anti-vandal” restrictions.
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Post by thebfg on Aug 12, 2019 18:35:50 GMT
Of course the opening times are at the behest of C&RT management ... same as on the K&A and the GU. You can't really blame the volockies for implementing that judgement JohnVRog Or making their own times up.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 12, 2019 18:41:20 GMT
If people have spare time like this they should be sent down the coal mines.
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Post by JohnV on Aug 12, 2019 18:42:54 GMT
We arrived at the top of Napton flight and stopped to water up. Almost immediately five boats arrived to go down, the second being a Napton hire boat with a young family. The first boat went into the lock, but the young family remained at their boat, despite Jane suggesting to the lady that she may want to take a windlass to the lock. Eventually the third boat owner told them they must go and turn the lock, or he would be taking it. I think many new boaters are hesitant and nervous and NEED to be told what to do and when by someone who knows. I liked the volockie we met at Hillmorton last week ... Jane commented that it was unusual to see one working alone there, to which he replied "I like to be alone, I'm a grumpy bastard." Rog I’m reminded of the volockies we encountered at one of the mechanised locks on the C&H bit of the A&C (near Stanley Ferry). They were perfectly pleasant and operated the lock for us. Apparently there are only volockies there on a Wednesday, and it was a Wednesday. But really, did we need some bods to press the buttons on the lock pedestal? One of the problems with the big locks on the NE waterways is that there are many boaters who will cheerfully operate a 200 foot lock just for themselves rather than waiting five minutes or so to try and get a few boats in. Fair enough when it's quiet out of season but not on summer weekends. should also point out there are still some proper lockies on these waters Some of the volockies on the Trent are ex bargemen and one at least ex BW and don't use the pedestals but operate from the control room ..... I have no beef with them at all ....... but with ordinary locks or coffin locks ..... you must be joking
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Post by lollygagger on Aug 12, 2019 18:44:03 GMT
I think the Wigan times are historically due to someone at the Wigan office arriving at work, having a coffee and then wandering up to unlock. Locking up timed again for someone to wander up, lock the flight then wander back to the office just in time to go home. A bit of a jolly for someone.
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