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Post by dogless on Apr 23, 2024 11:37:09 GMT
Following a discussion as we were cruising this morning, I wonder ...
a) how long have you been boating (hire, share, borrowed or private) ?
b) in your view has the system improved, got worse, or much as it ever was during that period ?
I'm not asking about the politics of funding, or management decisions, or the usual stuff ... just what your view of travelling the system is and why please.
Rog
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Post by β on Apr 23, 2024 11:45:34 GMT
30 yars living on Boats but I have not done much canal cruising in the last decade.
The River has deteriorated somewhat with a lot of lock gates having problems and too much vegetation in the woodwork.
The safety elfins have got their claws into the River and negative outcomes have been caused.
Having said that it does all work pretty well.
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Post by fi on Apr 23, 2024 11:55:05 GMT
Not been boating for that long (about 6 years + some hire years beforehand). Comments only about the GU south.
A slight/moderate decay, that could lead to worse. Locks and their repairs come and go, sometimes I see decay and bodge job repairs that are left for far far too long, but overall little change. Canal banks/towpaths is a different story, the banks in places are slowly collapsing either into the canal or holes appearing meaning some places especially lock landings you need to keep an eye out and be careful, I haven't seen any attempts to resolve these issues and wonder whether in the future some lock landings will get as bad as on the Huddersfield Narrow, where a single hander either needs a pair of waders or to jump from one bit of rubble to another to get to the bank.
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Post by β on Apr 23, 2024 12:03:41 GMT
I remember when the collapsed banks on the GU were just starting. In fact I was present when a 50ft length of concrete edging detached and fell into the canal. It was at a BW long term mooring I had moved my Boat the day before and informed the Board that the concrete was moving.
Then it was gone. Twisted slightly as it fell. Glad the Boat was not beside it !
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Post by thebfg on Apr 23, 2024 12:55:04 GMT
I'll have to say from my experience its stayed the same.
Went down the K and A when it was reopened. And it hasen't really changed. Water levels are still low, locks still leak.
There are more boats moored up. So perhaps that tips it to being worse.
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Post by cds on Apr 23, 2024 12:56:38 GMT
As Tony says youβve got the navigation authority you deserve hence the system you deserve.ππππ
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Post by Mr Stabby on Apr 23, 2024 13:13:49 GMT
There's been some deterioration since I've had my boat (10 years), a few Elsan points and other facilities closing, but overall I'd say it's all fairly minor stuff and not enough to diminish the experience in any great way.
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Post by Jim on Apr 23, 2024 15:09:43 GMT
Locks on the Rochdale could do with fettling promptly when they break, a greasing would help too. Otherwise not much has changed since I started canal boating in 2002. Most of my boating is out in west Yorkshire though we have done the L&L ring 3 or 4 times, once the ring to the south via trent and misery, once out to Beeston Castle, once to Albert Dock in Liverpool.
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Post by Mr Stabby on Apr 23, 2024 15:21:35 GMT
Locks on the Rochdale could do with fettling promptly when they break, a greasing would help too. Otherwise not much has changed since I started canal boating in 2002. Most of my boating is out in west Yorkshire though we have done the L&L ring 3 or 4 times, once the ring to the south via trent and misery, once out to Beeston Castle, once to Albert Dock in Liverpool. This post appeared on Faceache yesterday... "After having g a chat to a CRT guy in our marina , he informed us the plans to indefinitely close the Stannedge tunnel /huddersfield narrow and the Rochdale canal ! As every set of lock gates need replacing! And they simply donβt have the money !! That means all we will have up here is the Leeds Liverpool ! He says the tunnel needs lots of repairs too which they canβt afford !"
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Post by dogless on Apr 23, 2024 15:48:36 GMT
Although I asked the question, our morning's cruising discussion was based on how difficult it is to fairly judge.
There seems a reasonable balance of positives and negatives.
We first boated around 1989 at which time, and since then the system has expanded (K and A, Huddersfield narrow, Liverpool and Ribble Links all opened).
In our experience piling work on the Macclesfield, Llangollen and the Ashby for example, have made them much easier for mooring and less chance of grounding. Perhaps these improvements are linked to increased hire business.
Communication of stoppages thanks to www has greatly helped forward planning, but communication isn't always accurate it has to be agreed.
At the same time however, it is apparent that obvious necessary repairs are left undone until total failure results.
Services (particularly elsan and rubbish points) have been closed down without alternatives created.
There appears a greater reliance on boaters reporting issues, I assume because there's much less bank staff, and what staff that remains (in offices) appear to have little knowledge about the canal system (even the geography) which can be frustrating.
Having come to no real conclusion ourselves I thought it would be interesting to hear your views as many of you have been around longer.
Rog
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Post by brummieboy on Apr 23, 2024 18:58:26 GMT
Since the late 70's, things had got better, but now creeping back. Most of my boating is around the Midlands, and generally it has got much busier except on the BCN where you can still experience few delays and generally it is a lot more welcoming. I miss some of the atmospheric parts of Birmingham, and the Black Country but for being busier around the canals, it is less threatening. In built up areas one has to have a certain amount of sympathy for CaRT where they have to deal with non boater abuse with facilities. At Easter, I found the rubbish compound closed with bins moved across to the Boatyard. It inconvenienced me less than the individual who arrived in a car with about a dozen bags of rubbish. He didn't go over to the boatyard. . The redevelopment of the towpaths cycleways does not help and often the shore bound (non) customers do not always look favourably upon boaters. Maybe repairs take longer to get done, and the absence of lenghtsmen has taken away the wise souls who could anticipate niggles and prevent them from becoming disasters. The proliferation of pen pushers in CaRT doesn't help in getting jobs done as their contractors will obviously stretch out work, and the 'elf & safety' card is another weapon they can use without challenge. The 'green' lobby is also another thorn in the side where they can unfavourably affect the waterway for very spurious unchallenged claims. I always recall that in the Monty restoration, Aston Locks were delayed being opened, and were then restricted in use because of the Great Crested Newt. Before the volunteers did the job and it was put into water, where were the newts then? Similarly when the National was at Autherley a few years ago, a significant length of the prime moorings were closed off after some one thought they saw a water vole. ( It was thought at the time that it was a malicious act by the local angling club. For all that, the biggest delays are always allied to increased boat activity, so things can't be all bad if that is the case. In 2000, our Club cruised from Autherley to Burton, had half a day on a tour of Marstons and back to base within 8 days over Spring Bank Holiday. 25 years ago there was a lot more camaraderie with help at locks, but todays boaters don't seem to engage in that. The average boat may be longer now so there is less lock sharing. There also seems to me to be instances where the Continuous Cruisers are less inclusive in the whole community these days. As I said, we're based around the Midlands so elsewhere may be different, particularly up north where the resurrection of waterways and loss of reservoirs has resulted in problems there. Our local restorations I can recall, The South Stratford and the Stourbridge, seem to have been more successful.
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Post by β on Apr 23, 2024 20:57:41 GMT
Its good if one can enjoy life without bitterness.
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Post by Mr Stabby on Apr 23, 2024 21:07:33 GMT
The redevelopment of the towpaths cycleways does not help and often the shore bound (non) customers do not always look favourably upon boaters. CRT have to present the canals as being of benefit to more groups other than just boaters who are, rightly or wrongly (wrongly in my case) seen as being generally fairly wealthy and thus undeserving of subsidy.
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Post by Telemachus on Apr 23, 2024 21:49:52 GMT
Boating since the 1960s. Well, from say 1966 to 1976 when my school chum's dad had first a day cruiser, then a centre cockpit cruiser, then a bespoke woodentop narrowboat built by Rugby Boatbuilders (Colin Payne). Notable events were, aged 12 (and me being 6' tall) we were let loose by the parents to take the centre cockpit cruiser away for a 1/2 term weekend from the mooring at Lapworth into Birmingham. That was quite an adventure, and you can imagine parents of the 2020s letting their 12 year old kids do that! And then there was the trip up to Ripon on the narrowboat when I was around 18, a group of us (with no adults). Kids were resilient and competent in those days! Also a trip to Ely for an IWA rally with Chris' dad. I nearly sank the boat by leaving it on bottom lock gates in fwds tickover (outside the lock, waiting to go up) whilst the lock filled for the boat ahead - and leaked like buggery into the well deck and into the open front doors! Chris' dad was most displeased. Then a long hiatus until I introduced Jeff to narrowboating around 1992, on Chris' new narrowboat. In the 16 years from 76 to 92, a big difference in the number of live aboard boats (virtually zero before), a big difference in the number of incompetent private owner boaters, but I would say the system - and certainly the Birmingham area - was much improved. Central Brum having gone from a grimy dingy back-of-factories, to the Brindley Place etc we see now. Canals were cleaner. Between 92 and now, even more boats, many more moored boats, too many people who don't know how to tie their boats up and shout at you when you pass at tickover, even more totally incompetent and prissy private owners, too many "one click wonders" operating paddles, control-freak volockies, and generally a massive dumbing down of boating. But masses more piling which makes mooring much easier. Recently I would say more lock gates and beams in dire condition, held together with bits of steel etc. And those ridiculous yellow bags over paddles which say "this item is undergoing repair" when what they actually mean is "this thing is buggered and we can't be bothered to repair it until the other one breaks too"
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Post by β on Apr 23, 2024 22:04:31 GMT
The broken paddle thing is very sad.
Canals were designed by competent people who knew their shit.
Having two paddles isn't just a fun way to arrange it there is also the fact that one can still operate the lock even if there is a failure on one paddle. Redundancy and the broken one (probably not a complicated problem) can be fixed without down time.
Dumbing down is a good term for this but that is happening everywhere. I have had to explain this to my girls ad nauseam and luckily my work has paid off because they can see dumbing down a mile off.
It is a shame, but in the end it is better than clutching your nuts, everyone's going to pieces, pulling out guns for a mercy clipping and all your intestines is mashed out through your balls.
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