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Post by TonyDunkley on Aug 25, 2018 19:09:22 GMT
For the holiday boater with little or no previous experience of the waters they're entering, tidal rivers busy with commercial traffic and shipping are potentially very dangerous places to be. The odds against surviving unscathed on a holiday jaunt on the Thames' London tideway have recently been drastically shortened with C&RT effectively washing their hands of any responsibility for the safety and 'wellbeing' of their 'customers' as they despatch them from Limehouse without bothering to inform the Thames' Vessel Traffic Services (VTS) of their presence on the busiest and most congested few miles of commercially used river in the UK.
On 10 August last Mr Stabby of this forum was involved in an incident in which his boat was carried sideways by the tide into one of the piers of the Blackfriars Bridges when although technically being the 'stand-on' vessel he attempted to stop and giveway to a tug and tow approaching Blackfriars Bridges from the opposite direction.
This incident was by no means a 'one-off' and there have in fact recently been an increasing number of similar incidents involving pleasure craft entering the river at Limehouse bound for either Brentford or Oxford. Including the 10 August incident at Blackfriars Bridges there are now eight recent, similar incidents for the Port of London Authority (PLA) to look into. It has been established that one of the major factors contributing to every one of the recent incidents is that C&RT and their wholly owned subsidiary, BWML, are releasing pleasure craft into the Thames at Limehouse and failing, in every instance, to notify the PLA's Vessel Traffic Services (VTS) of the presence of these inbound pleasure craft on what is the busiest part of the river with the greatest concentration of bridges and large and/or fast moving commercial vessels.
The number and frequency of the recent incidents are a matter of great concern to the PLA, and they will be taking whatever steps are necessary to put an end to the bad practices that are behind these dangerous occurences. Notwithstanding the gloom mongering about narrow canal boats being banned from the London river that was evident on the 'Water restrictions' topic with regard the increasing number of incidents involving this type of vessel, there is no agenda, hidden or otherwise, on the part of the PLA to do any such thing, or to penalize any of the pleasure boaters involved. The Authority's sole concern is to put a rapid end to the sloppy and potentially dangerous practices and procedures that have become the norm for many of the visiting pleasure boaters and their neighboring Harbour Authority, the Canal & River Trust.
To this end it would be most helpful if anyone who has made the Limehouse - Brentford passage, in either direction, could put together and post a brief account including any concerns about anything of note which might have occurred during the passage, and details of any instructions, information and advice they were given by C&RT lockstaff prior to entering the river at either Limehouse, Brentford or Bow.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 25, 2018 19:44:32 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Aug 25, 2018 20:22:50 GMT
It has been established that one of the major factors contributing to every one of the recent incidents is that C&RT and their wholly owned subsidiary, BWML, are releasing pleasure craft into the Thames at Limehouse and failing, in every instance, to notify the PLA's Vessel Traffic Services (VTS) of the presence of these inbound pleasure craft on what is the busiest part of the river with the greatest concentration of bridges and large and/or fast moving commercial vessels. If I have understood previous stuff about this, it isn't CRT or BWML's responsibility to inform the PLA or the boater of their responsibilities (please correct me if I'm wrong). Obviously you (and me - but don't take much notice of what I think, I'm just learning) you think they should inform the PLA. Might be worthwhile if you explained why and how this might affect 'personal' responsibility for informing PLA. As you have 'named names', Magnetman has admitted to not informing the PLA of his trips - I'm struggling to understand whether you (and maybe others) wish a change of the rules or people to know and abide by the rules.
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Post by TonyDunkley on Aug 25, 2018 20:30:18 GMT
It would be helpful if you could provide the date or dates of your most recent trips to pass on to the PLA to confirm their fears that C&RT aren't bothering to pass on the navigational and procedure advice literature they are being supplied with. The Assistant Harbour Master for the London river has confirmed over the last couple of days that they regularly provide C&RT/BWML with large quantities of printed material to pass on to pleasure craft, preferably as soon as possible after booking passage onto the river or, at the very least several hours in advance of passage through the tidal locks at Limehouse, Brentford or Bow. The PLA guidance does include advice to pleasure craft without VHF to contact the London VTS by phone and includes a direct dial number for doing so, and they tell me that the mobile phone coverage throughout the busiest part of the river in central London with the greatest frequency of bridges is excellent with no 'dead' spots. It would seem, however, that C&RT are determined to keep the PLA's advice and guidance a secret from those for whom it's intended, and whose safety is enhanced by it . In the 10 August incident at Blackfriars Bridges the boater involved stated that the Isophase or VQF Whites were not showing as he approached the bridge upriver with the flood under him.
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Post by TonyDunkley on Aug 25, 2018 20:58:55 GMT
I'd say there's no 'maybe' about it. I've only just looked quickly at the stuff in those two links of yours, but it appears to contain plenty of first rate advice and pretty much everything needed in the way of instructions and guidance for the Limehouse - Brentford passages. Those BW Thames guides serve well to emphasize the distinction between a genuine navigation/harbour authority and a bunch of irresponsible clowns whose priorities don't take them much beyond painting duck lanes on canal towpaths and ensuring that there's only just about enough water left in the canals for any ducks that want to avoid being run over by a bike to swim in.
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Post by naughtyfox on Aug 25, 2018 21:33:51 GMT
Here's a video for everyone to analyse. Keep an eye out for sharp jutting out edges, mines, mermaids and whales.
Blackfriars Bridge at 2:48 - and if you don't know what bridge is what, take a map with you.
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Post by JohnV on Aug 25, 2018 22:26:49 GMT
I'm afraid it's about 6 years since I was on the tideway in central London at the helm of a private boat and at least 2 years since being crew on a commercial boat and then I spent most of my time in the engine room working on the electrics.
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Post by naughtyfox on Aug 26, 2018 6:25:12 GMT
For people who like the River Thames, why not do a walking holiday all the way up it, or follow it on a bicycle? From Tower Bridge all the way to where it starts somewhere in the Cotswolds. Just keep crossing every bridge. Not a bad idea for someone who has a holiday coming but doesn't know what to do. It was an idea I had for us to do before we bought our narrowboat. Also, walking along canal towpaths the length & breadth of the country - can't get lost, easy terrain, lots to look at, a bit of wild camping and B&Bs/hotels.
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Post by naughtyfox on Aug 26, 2018 6:26:57 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Aug 26, 2018 7:35:33 GMT
A pack raft would be essential.
The towpaths and barge walks used to be joined up by ferries when it was necessary to change sides. There are a lot of places where private land interferes with access to the river bank. Virtually all of these ferries are now history and there are places where you would have walked a few miles along the "towing path' only to find your route blocked by private land and you would have to find a road to walk along or go back. Most of the roads are 60mph with no walkway available so not pleasant for walking.
If you had a pack raft you could paddle across at the old ferry points.
That'd work OK.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 26, 2018 7:48:09 GMT
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Post by Deleted on Aug 26, 2018 8:16:42 GMT
Having looked back I am surprised to find that my last trip was 2013. Note to self must do it again before I abandon cart waterways.
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Post by JohnV on Aug 26, 2018 8:26:15 GMT
there are two very good books on towpath walks by Brian Bearshaw "The great Towpath Walk" (London to York) and his earlier "Towpaths of England" both some 40 years old now
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Post by Deleted on Aug 26, 2018 8:30:04 GMT
Better to do it by boat. In 2007 on Parglena we managed from QE2 bridge to 100metres short of Hannington bridge which was a bridge to far.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 26, 2018 9:07:33 GMT
I was quite surprised how much quicker you can get up to Yorkshire via the River Trent (tidal and non-tidal). This for example from Canal Plan ...
Trip from Hillmorton to York Marina
Via River Trent 218 miles, 59 locks, 83 hours
Canalplan shortest (via canal route) 202 miles, 177 locks, 110 hours.
So that’s nearly 4 days quicker using the Trent due to a significant reduction in locks.
Rivers are fine so long as you are prepared for an emergency. An anchor is number one on the list for me. As I said you can buy a VHF handheld for less than £20 but a mobile phone works in many situations.
Rivers are also great fun, so don’t let anyone put you off! (or provide evidence which plays into the hands of those who want to ban narrow boats from rivers).
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