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Post by bodger on Sept 29, 2019 14:49:34 GMT
Well I very much appreciate your comments and view but really, with respect, it is not a wish more a considered belief and, until someone can confirm definitively what does happen after death, I believe all options remain on the table What people blatantly fail to understand is that nothing ever starts or ends and all activity everywhere is simply a random interaction of chemical elements. People only think they are alive because they are trapped in a human brain and can only frame external factors in relation to their own lives. The world never "started" it will never "end" and nothing ever "happens". It's just all a massive chaotic jumble which nobody can do anything about. The fact they think they can is what makes it so stressful ! that is an excellent summary of our condition. have a virtual pint.
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Post by Clinton Cool on Sept 29, 2019 15:12:19 GMT
It's impossible to prove anything. The only provable things refer to already formed assumptions. It's good to hear other opinions on this sort of thing I agree with that. Even if they are all wrong. I had a girlfriend when I lived in Indonesia who was a pretty staunch Muslim. She was totally adamant that god exists, she stated it was a proven fact. So I suppose you could say it is possible to prove something, but only to some people. To other people, ones like me, it's all a load of bollocks.
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Post by kris on Sept 29, 2019 15:21:40 GMT
sorry jub, it's called wishful thinking, but if it gives you comfort it does no harm, provided it is not associated with a religion that pretends to be tolerant but preaches hate and hellfire against infidels (and that is by no means limited to followers of Mohd.). Well I very much appreciate your comments and view but really, with respect, it is not a wish more a considered belief and, until someone can confirm definitively what does happen after death, I believe all options remain on the table Maybe its belief that is important. So if you believe the soul carries on to "somewhere" else after the body has gone then maybe thats what happens. Conversly if you belive that when the body dies you die and there is nothing after then maybe thats what happens to you. Belief is a very strong human trait, we all have beliefs in something even if they arent religious beliefs.people are willing to fight and die for what they believe it is a very powerful thing.
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Post by Mr Stabby on Sept 29, 2019 15:32:24 GMT
Worms eat you then they poo you out. You might then help to fertilise a blade of grass or a flower. But that's about it.
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Post by Mr Stabby on Sept 29, 2019 15:34:25 GMT
It's impossible to prove anything. The only provable things refer to already formed assumptions. It's good to hear other opinions on this sort of thing I agree with that. Even if they are all wrong. I had a girlfriend when I lived in Indonesia who was a pretty staunch Muslim. She was totally adamant that god exists, she stated it was a proven fact. So I suppose you could say it is possible to prove something, but only to some people. To other people, ones like me, it's all a load of bollocks. All religions are faiths, and the whole point of a faith is that it is something which people believe in, the existence of which cannot be proven.
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Post by ianali on Sept 29, 2019 15:36:42 GMT
This is one of those discussions that go around in circles. I am not religious, however I do believe in the afterlife. I also believe I have seen a ghost. I have no idea what happens after death but I reckon something does.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 29, 2019 15:37:48 GMT
Belief is a very strong human trait, we all have beliefs in something even if they arent religious beliefs.people are willing to fight and die for what they believe it is a very powerful thing. True. Everyone has to believe in something. I believe I will have another beer.
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Post by kris on Sept 29, 2019 15:50:52 GMT
Belief is a very strong human trait, we all have beliefs in something even if they arent religious beliefs.people are willing to fight and die for what they believe it is a very powerful thing. True. Everyone has to believe in something. I believe I will have another beer. Thats something very tangible to believe in. Ive got faith that you will have another beer.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 29, 2019 16:08:53 GMT
Worms eat you then they poo you out. You might then help to fertilise a blade of grass or a flower. But that's about it. You're wrong, worms don't like ashes - a proven fact
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Post by naughtyfox on Sept 29, 2019 16:18:02 GMT
to believe in that you have to believe that humans have a consciousness that separates us from all other members of the animal kingdom, and that can in some way outlive our mouldering or cremated carcass. I would like to hear views from those who know better to explain at what stage of evolution this consciousness first appeared. How do we know bacteria don't have a consciousness? Perhaps some of those bacteria in your duodenum are planning a party in Benidorm? Do animals such as cats and dogs have consciousness, self-awareness? Do they think?
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Post by naughtyfox on Sept 29, 2019 16:35:23 GMT
something with intelligence must have created us. That's getting into the area of the Americans' 'Intelligent Design' teachings, which I consider without foundation. I am a Richard Dawkins natural evolution person, although that also is hard to comprehend there is scientific logic (and evidence) to it. I have always and continue to have vivid dreams which are always like films but I do not know where the images,or people, in them come from. My partner sighs whenever I say 'I had a dream last night' and then recount it in minute detail, like a film or a book.... Same here. I have little or no imagination when I'm awake, rubbish at drawing and designing for example,* but I have dreams where I'm really there and can see everything in detail. Where this imagination comes from must just be stored memories and my natural drive to go exploring. But I do realise my dreams are based on my real life, as they are all too often about bus driving and travelling.
*I'm quite clever at coming up with plans and timetables though, and I can see "in my mind's eye" much in detail, but that could be the same as for other people (?). I could walk around inside our boat and touch things, such as the surface of our kitchen table, and know what it's like to touch it, and I can 'smell' the boat - the smell of the coal in the cratch, the smell of that blue liquid that goes in the Thetford, the smell of the whole boat as we first open the back doors... ..just memories stored somewhere. I just don't get it how all these memories are stored, where is the room for a lifetime of memories in the human brain? Let's say someone asks you what you did on August 4th 2007. You'd probably have no idea. But if you were shown a video of what you did that day, I bet you'd start catching on and saying yes I remember that, and remember what's coming next.
I think that as people get older, old memories that have been stored for all those years start coming to the surface again, probably as your brain starts to decompose, as with 'dementia' - can't remember what you did 2 minutes ago, but can remember what you did on holiday 40 years ago perfectly.
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Post by naughtyfox on Sept 29, 2019 16:39:56 GMT
A genuine enquiry ... do you believe all living beings enjoy life after death or just humans ? Rog dolphins and elephants are supposed to have extremely high intelligence We don't have any elephants or dolphins on Thunderboat expressing their views on consciousness. But that could mean they're cleverer than us and are just having a good time enjoying living.
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Post by bodger on Sept 29, 2019 16:41:05 GMT
to believe in that you have to believe that humans have a consciousness that separates us from all other members of the animal kingdom, and that can in some way outlive our mouldering or cremated carcass. I would like to hear views from those who know better to explain at what stage of evolution this consciousness first appeared. How do we know bacteria don't have a consciousness? Perhaps some of those bacteria in your duodenum are planning a party in Benidorm? Do animals such as cats and dogs have consciousness, self-awareness? Do they think? what do you think? The best explanation was given earlier by Magnetman. Yuval Harari, in Homo Deus also put it this way: "... emotions are biochemical algorithms that are vital for the survival of all mammals".We humans are grossly arrogant if we believe we are special, and this is, for me, one of the main reasons why I detest god-botherers.
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Post by naughtyfox on Sept 29, 2019 16:44:48 GMT
So let's say you die. But your 'soul' still exists. What are you going to do now? Probably there's nothing to do and nowhere to go. No friends to talk to. Might as well be dead.
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Post by naughtyfox on Sept 29, 2019 16:47:13 GMT
Next week: Do Boats Have Souls?
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