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Post by Jim on Jan 17, 2019 17:32:43 GMT
No, the last opinion poll was advisory, not mandatory like a proper referendum. it was binding ...... you are only carrying on because you didn't get the result you wanted.Β You were not in the majority .... Tough Do what the leavers had to do the first time. Suck it up and get on with it.Β Accept the majority decision. That is what democracy means, you accept the decisions and do your best to make it work, not act like a spoilt child. No it was not set up as a legally binding referendum, it was set up as advisory. That's how that fine tory mate of yours, Ken Clark, gets away with calling it an opinion poll. And that's a fine idea, "do your best to make it work" they should try that one. ππππ
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2019 17:33:25 GMT
Old Nokia phones had great reception in marginal areas, they were the go to phone for walkers/mountaineers. Think the 3310 was most popular although maybe an earlier version - batteries lasted for days and you nearly always got reception when others that took the piss out of your 'brick' couldn't.
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Post by Andyberg on Jan 17, 2019 17:39:00 GMT
Old Nokia phones had great reception in marginal areas, they were the go to phone for walkers/mountaineers. Think the 3310 was most popular although maybe an earlier version - batteries lasted for days and you nearly always got reception when others that took the piss out of your 'brick' couldn't. I used to take one for emergencies with a Β£10 payg sim when I enduro'd... tough as old boots, pretty waterproof and always worked, better than smashing my iphone! Still have a bag full of used 3310's from jobs gone by...If anyone wants one sending out drop me a pmπ
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Post by Albion on Jan 17, 2019 17:51:21 GMT
Oh dear, can't be asked to look back and see what you posted which was, and I copy and paste from YOURS, and it WAS the post to which I was replying: The deal (when it's been agreedππππ) no deal (unless that's taken off the agenda) or remain. Simple. So we have three options in your post to which I was replying:- The deal (when it's been agreed ππππ) No deal (unless that's taken off the agenda) Or remain. So what part of your post is deal or no deal and not remain? Roger I was replying to your post which seems to be saying there shouldn't be a choice to remain? Here you go; Sorry, I should have said preventing the Remainers influencing the CHOICE of leave voters for which type of leave they wanted. If the Remainers win then there is no other choice for the Leavers. You cannot give those that have already voted Remain the ability to influence the choice of way in which the leave voters opt for in a simple two part, first past the post, referendum because it would be like allowing them to to influence something that they did not vote for, ie two bites at the cherry, when the leavers only have one bite. If you want to allow Leavers to have some influence over a successful Remain vote then you might have a case to make but there are not two forms of Remain so for fairness only those voting Leave should be allowed to progress to question 2. It is merely a matter of parity. It would be like a General Election where, just for the sake of this example, a Tory voter was allowed to state a choice for a Liberal candidate, if his Tory didn't get elected, but saying that a Labour voter could only vote for the Labour candidate. Roger Read more: thunderboat.boards.net/thread/4541/confidence?page=9#ixzz5ct2ANyO8Nope, even in that one I was saying that after having voted Remain, the Remain voters should not be allowed to enter a vote in which choice of leave that Leavers wanted. It would have been a choice that only leavers were allowed to make because the Remainers had already made their primary choice. Once a Leaver had chosen leave then they would have the choice of which of two versions of leave they preferred. Otherwise, if given a straight three way choice on the referendum paper of Remain, Leave with a deal, Leave with no deal, you automatically split the leave vote numbers and deliver a certain victory to the remain people. That would neither be fair nor democratic. Roger
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Post by Deleted on Jan 17, 2019 18:06:36 GMT
Old Nokia phones had great reception in marginal areas, they were the go to phone for walkers/mountaineers. Think the 3310 was most popular although maybe an earlier version - batteries lasted for days and you nearly always got reception when others that took the piss out of your 'brick' couldn't. I used to take one for emergencies with a Β£10 payg sim when I enduro'd... tough as old boots, pretty waterproof and always worked, better than smashing my iphone! Still have a bag full of used 3310's from jobs gone by...If anyone wants one sending out drop me a pmπ Currently have a Toughphone Defender Pro, used extensively but not been put to the real test yet, last phone was a Defender 2 which very much was put to the test after it withstood a significant fall (me and the phone) and a dunking (not me). Good phones if you need/want a rugged one. Not cheap though.
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Post by Jim on Jan 17, 2019 18:11:48 GMT
I was replying to your post which seems to be saying there shouldn't be a choice to remain? Here you go; Sorry, I should have said preventing the Remainers influencing the CHOICE of leave voters for which type of leave they wanted. If the Remainers win then there is no other choice for the Leavers. You cannot give those that have already voted Remain the ability to influence the choice of way in which the leave voters opt for in a simple two part, first past the post, referendum because it would be like allowing them to to influence something that they did not vote for, ie two bites at the cherry, when the leavers only have one bite. If you want to allow Leavers to have some influence over a successful Remain vote then you might have a case to make but there are not two forms of Remain so for fairness only those voting Leave should be allowed to progress to question 2. It is merely a matter of parity. It would be like a General Election where, just for the sake of this example, a Tory voter was allowed to state a choice for a Liberal candidate, if his Tory didn't get elected, but saying that a Labour voter could only vote for the Labour candidate. Roger Read more: thunderboat.boards.net/thread/4541/confidence?page=9#ixzz5ct2ANyO8Nope, even in that one I was saying that after having voted Remain, the Remain voters should not be allowed to enter a vote in which choice of leave that Leavers wanted. It would have been a choice that only leavers were allowed to make because the Remainers had already made their primary choice. Once a Leaver had chosen leave then they would have the choice of which of two versions of leave they preferred. Otherwise, if given a straight three way choice on the referendum paper of Remain, Leave with a deal, Leave with no deal, you automatically split the leave vote numbers and deliver a certain victory to the remain people. That would neither be fair nor democratic. Roger Neither is it fair or democratic that "remain" is not on the ticket, when people can see what the deal is. There could be only 2 choices, remain or deal, if quitters were united in what they want. If they cannot unite thats their problem, they have created the farcical situation.
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Post by kris on Jan 17, 2019 18:16:00 GMT
Nope, even in that one I was saying that after having voted Remain, the Remain voters should not be allowed to enter a vote in which choice of leave that Leavers wanted. It would have been a choice that only leavers were allowed to make because the Remainers had already made their primary choice. Once a Leaver had chosen leave then they would have the choice of which of two versions of leave they preferred. Otherwise, if given a straight three way choice on the referendum paper of Remain, Leave with a deal, Leave with no deal, you automatically split the leave vote numbers and deliver a certain victory to the remain people. That would neither be fair nor democratic. Roger Neither is it fair or democratic that "remain" is not on the ticket, when people can see what the deal is. There could be only 2 choices, remain or deal, if quitters were united in what they want. If they cannot unite thats their problem, they have created the farcical situation. No David Cameron created this situation and then ran away. The politicians are like kids that have had two years to do their homework, but they are doing it at the last minute. A second referendum would increase the uncertainty and just prolong the situation. Jim as I've asked you before do you really think the eu would let us stay in now with no repercussions?
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Post by peterboat on Jan 17, 2019 18:20:47 GMT
it was binding ...... you are only carrying on because you didn't get the result you wanted. You were not in the majority .... Tough Do what the leavers had to do the first time. Suck it up and get on with it. Accept the majority decision. That is what democracy means, you accept the decisions and do your best to make it work, not act like a spoilt child. No it was not set up as a legally binding referendum, it was set up as advisory. That's how that fine tory mate of yours, Ken Clark, gets away with calling it an opinion poll. And that's a fine idea, "do your best to make it work" they should try that one. ππππ My voting form said we will carry out whatever is voted for! done at vast expense , and with a huge turnout, which was over a million in favour of leave. it was challenged in court and eventually passed as a law very democratic far better than what is happening now idiot Corbyn asking that no deal is taken off the table before he will talk to the Government what a twat!!
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Post by Jim on Jan 17, 2019 18:23:13 GMT
Neither is it fair or democratic that "remain" is not on the ticket, when people can see what the deal is. There could be only 2 choices, remain or deal, if quitters were united in what they want. If they cannot unite thats their problem, they have created the farcical situation. No David Cameron created this situation and then ran away. The politicians are like kids that have had two years to do their homework, but they are doing it at the last minute. A second referendum would increase the uncertainty and just prolong the situation. Jim as I've asked you before do you really think the eu would let us stay in now with no repercussions?Β Yes they would welcome us back.
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Post by peterboat on Jan 17, 2019 18:25:14 GMT
No David Cameron created this situation and then ran away. The politicians are like kids that have had two years to do their homework, but they are doing it at the last minute. A second referendum would increase the uncertainty and just prolong the situation. Jim as I've asked you before do you really think the eu would let us stay in now with no repercussions? Yes they would welcome us back. They would and our arses would be sore for a few months before the EU falls apart
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Post by Jim on Jan 17, 2019 18:25:42 GMT
No it was not set up as a legally binding referendum, it was set up as advisory. That's how that fine tory mate of yours, Ken Clark, gets away with calling it an opinion poll. And that's a fine idea, "do your best to make it work" they should try that one. ππππ My voting form said we will carry out whatever is voted for! done at vast expense , and with a huge turnout, which was over a million in favour of leave. it was challenged in court and eventually passed as a law very democratic far better than what is happening now idiot Corbyn asking that no deal is taken off the table before he will talk to the Government what a twat!! I agree, but there is a difference between a legally binding referendum and one where you just say you will carry it out. You could change your mind without legal consequences, though that might not be moral.
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Post by kris on Jan 17, 2019 18:27:45 GMT
No David Cameron created this situation and then ran away. The politicians are like kids that have had two years to do their homework, but they are doing it at the last minute. A second referendum would increase the uncertainty and just prolong the situation. Jim as I've asked you before do you really think the eu would let us stay in now with no repercussions? Yes they would welcome us back. If you actually believe that, then your crazier than I realised. Europe is heading for trouble, Germany is on the edge of a recession. France has got civil unrest, these are the two biggest contributors.
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Post by duncan on Jan 17, 2019 18:30:56 GMT
No, the last opinion poll was advisory, not mandatory like a proper referendum. it was binding ...... you are only carrying on because you didn't get the result you wanted. You were not in the majority .... Tough Do what the leavers had to do the first time. Suck it up and get on with it. Accept the majority decision. That is what democracy means, you accept the decisions and do your best to make it work, not act like a spoilt child.That should be aimed at Corbyn, never mind Jim
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Post by Mr Stabby on Jan 17, 2019 18:31:37 GMT
I have a Nokia. I've had Nokias for ever apart from a Samsung that I didn't get on with. The one I have now, a 6230i, I bought a few months ago and was brand-new old stock, so it's about 13 years old but had never been used. Just sitting in a warehouse somewhere for all those years. Still in the original packaging. In years to come, after the fall and rebirth of civilisation, mankind will drain a lock on the Staffs and Worcs canal, find an earlier Nokia 6230i I owned, and wonder what on earth it is.
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Post by Mr Stabby on Jan 17, 2019 18:44:50 GMT
it was binding ...... you are only carrying on because you didn't get the result you wanted. You were not in the majority .... Tough Do what the leavers had to do the first time. Suck it up and get on with it. Accept the majority decision. That is what democracy means, you accept the decisions and do your best to make it work, not act like a spoilt child. No it was not set up as a legally binding referendum, it was set up as advisory. That's how that fine tory mate of yours, Ken Clark, gets away with calling it an opinion poll. And that's a fine idea, "do your best to make it work" they should try that one. ππππ The thing is Jim, that if there was a second referendum (or "people's vote" as you Remoaners seem to insist on calling it, as if a referendum isn't a people's vote) then the result would very likely be the same. There has been no huge groundswell against the decision to leave, and the only person I personally know who has said that he would vote differently in a second referendum is my boy Sam, who you have met, who voted Remain last time but has said he would vote Brexit this time. Anecdotal evidence suggests however that many people who voted remain are so embarrassed by this "sour grapes" loser mentality you and your fellow travellers are displaying that they would vote Brexit this time simply to dissociate themselves from it. Screaming Lord Sutch, Monster Raving Loony, reborn... So when the British electorate voted against Fascism a second time, what then? A third referendum? What would you call it this time?
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