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Post by Mr Stabby on Aug 21, 2022 10:01:25 GMT
When traffic is one-way and operating northbound, say, once the boats have been let out at Tarleton the lock crew there are finished for the day. When there is two-way working they are required to be back there later to let the southbound boats back in. Being in attendance when the state of the tide makes lock operation possible goes with the job of lock keeping at a tide lock. Besides which, again, . . it isn't the number of boats, or the direction they're going, that determines the period for which a tide lock is operable -- it's the state, or level, of the tide. Well, that's what the ground crew at Mayors Boatyard, who operate Tarleton lock, told me so if you have any issue with that then I suggest you take it up with them. However, I think you'll find that lock keeping isn't their only job or even a substantial part of it. But like I said, ask them.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2022 10:18:15 GMT
It seems that Mr Stabby, pearley , IainS and haggis have all completed the Millenium Ribble Link in both directions and will have first-hand personal knowledge of how it worked on their trips. I'm sure none of them would describe themselves as expert, but they certainly have greater knowledge and experience than I ... and indeed anyone else who hasn't completed the trip. Rog
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2022 10:23:16 GMT
And we have to wait even bludy longer to see the stunning result...there are more exciting bowls matches.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 21, 2022 10:26:36 GMT
Who sorry ?
Rog
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Post by Tony Dunkley on Aug 21, 2022 13:16:50 GMT
Being in attendance when the state of the tide makes lock operation possible goes with the job of lock keeping at a tide lock. Besides which, again, . . it isn't the number of boats, or the direction they're going, that determines the period for which a tide lock is operable -- it's the state, or level, of the tide. Well, that's what the ground crew at Mayors Boatyard, who operate Tarleton lock, told me so if you have any issue with that then I suggest you take it up with them. However, I think you'll find that lock keeping isn't their only job or even a substantial part of it. But like I said, ask them. The responsibility for having lock keepers in attendance at a sea-lock - and that's what Tarleton Lock is - over the period when the state of the tide allows penning, rests with the navigation authority with control of the lock, or with what's known as the 'competent harbour authority'. At Tarleton, the C&RT is both, . . and as such is also obliged, by law, to provide 'refuge from the tide' for any vessel able (by virtue of its draught, length, and breadth) to pass through any sea-lock at any given state of the tide. I don't doubt that what you've been told about lock operation at Tarleton is true, . . but the ultimate responsibility, obligation even, to provide lock keeper coverage there on demand or whenever needed is the navigation/competent harbour authority's. I will be taking the matter up in the coming week, . . but it won't be with Harry Mayor and the others at Tarleton. Thanks for passing on what you were told by them, . . very useful to know. It seems to me that C&RT's one-way only operation nonsense has far more to do with C&RT side-stepping as much of its lock operation duties and responsibilities as it can - and dumping as much of them on Mayors Boatyard as it can - than it has ever had to do with the "safety concerns" it states it has over two-way operation in the Douglas and the Ribble, . . something that made no sense at all. I was astounded when C&RT admitted last week that its one-way operation only rule between Tarleton and the Ribble Link (Preston end) canal basin had NOTHING whatsoever to do with width, or passing difficulties, in Savick Brook. After having let that cat out of the bag, C&RT's NW Region Boating & Customer Service Manager was noticeably reluctant to go into any further detail, . . and I did wonder why. I think you may have just provided the answer.
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Post by kris on Aug 21, 2022 13:31:45 GMT
Haven’t you got your own thread for this sort of thing Tony?
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Post by IainS on Aug 21, 2022 21:14:10 GMT
When traffic is one-way and operating northbound, say, once the boats have been let out at Tarleton the lock crew there are finished for the day. When there is two-way working they are required to be back there later to let the southbound boats back in. Being in attendance when the state of the tide makes lock operation possible goes with the job of lock keeping at a tide lock. Besides which, again, . . it isn't the number of boats, or the direction they're going, that determines the period for which a tide lock is operable -- it's the state, or level, of the tide. Plus staff availability. Try getting passage through a tidal lock (apart from one at a major port) at 3a.m.!
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Post by Mr Stabby on Aug 21, 2022 21:51:25 GMT
Well, that's what the ground crew at Mayors Boatyard, who operate Tarleton lock, told me so if you have any issue with that then I suggest you take it up with them. However, I think you'll find that lock keeping isn't their only job or even a substantial part of it. But like I said, ask them. I was astounded when C&RT admitted last week that its one-way operation only rule between Tarleton and the Ribble Link (Preston end) canal basin had NOTHING whatsoever to do with width, or passing difficulties, in Savick Brook. Why's that then? Even on days when two-way operation is in effect, there is no possibility of boats passing each other in Savick Brook. Both northbound and southbound boats would cross at or near Asland Lamp.
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Post by thebfg on Aug 22, 2022 1:07:23 GMT
I do hope Tony's supporters vote, they may not want to post but they can all vote.
Come on now, don't be shy. We could have TB'S biggest poll results.
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Post by Tony Dunkley on Aug 22, 2022 5:03:10 GMT
Being in attendance when the state of the tide makes lock operation possible goes with the job of lock keeping at a tide lock. Besides which, again, . . it isn't the number of boats, or the direction they're going, that determines the period for which a tide lock is operable -- it's the state, or level, of the tide. Plus staff availability. Try getting passage through a tidal lock (apart from one at a major port) at 3a.m.! British Waterways began chipping away at the customs and rules that used to go with being a navigation or competent harbour authority in control of sea or tide locks back in the 1980's, . . now, their successors are simply carrying on with the bad work where the last shower left off. I don't know when, or how, the obligation to give 'refuge from the tide' first came about, or what weight of law it actually carries nowadays, . . but I do know that BWB and C&RT have met with little to no opposition to this particular aspect of the general move towards making the running and operating of waterways and navigations into a 9 till 5 activity conducted from behind an office desk. If C&RT, or any of its its bank staff and lock keepers only want, or expect, to work from 9 till 5 for 5 days a week, . . they're in the wrong job !
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Post by JohnV on Aug 22, 2022 5:24:20 GMT
Plus staff availability. Try getting passage through a tidal lock (apart from one at a major port) at 3a.m.! British Waterways began chipping away at the customs and rules that used to go with being a navigation or competent harbour authority in control of sea or tide locks back in the 1980's, . . now, their successors are simply carrying on with the bad work where the last shower left off. I don't know when, or how, the obligation to give 'refuge from the tide' first came about, or what weight of law it actually carries, . . but I do know that BWB and C&RT have met with little to no opposition to this particular aspect of the general move towards making the running and operating of waterways and navigations into a 9 till 5 activity conducted from behind an office desk. If C&RT, or any of its its bank staff and lock keepers only want, or expect, to work from 9 till 5 for 5 days a week, . . they're in the wrong job ! There are restricted hours (not relating to tides) at Ocean Lock ...... they also get very sniffy if they are not given 24 hours notice as well (ABP)
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Post by Tony Dunkley on Aug 22, 2022 6:00:58 GMT
I was astounded when C&RT admitted last week that its one-way operation only rule between Tarleton and the Ribble Link (Preston end) canal basin had NOTHING whatsoever to do with width, or passing difficulties, in Savick Brook. Why's that then? Even on days when two-way operation is in effect, there is no possibility of boats passing each other in Savick Brook. Both northbound and southbound boats would cross at or near Asland Lamp. There's absolutely no sound reason whatsoever for not having pleasure craft making passage between Tarleton and the Lancaster Canal, in either direction, and on every day that there's a big enough daylight tide. Whichever direction they're going, NO craft, but especially those inbound for the Lancaster Canal, should be anywhere near either the Savick Brook outfall or the Asland Light at or near to local High Water. Negotiating locations in ANY tidal river, at local HW, where there's extensive shoaling AND a difficult to follow navigation channel is ill-advised to say the least, and should be avoided if at all possible. When you say - "there is no possibility of boats passing each other in Savick Brook" - are you putting that down to limited width and depth in Savick Brook, . . or the fact that the departure times from Tarleton or Preston result in everything that's underway on passage meeting up in the vicinity of the Asland Light ?
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Post by Tony Dunkley on Aug 22, 2022 6:47:30 GMT
British Waterways began chipping away at the customs and rules that used to go with being a navigation or competent harbour authority in control of sea or tide locks back in the 1980's, . . now, their successors are simply carrying on with the bad work where the last shower left off. I don't know when, or how, the obligation to give 'refuge from the tide' first came about, or what weight of law it actually carries, . . but I do know that BWB and C&RT have met with little to no opposition to this particular aspect of the general move towards making the running and operating of waterways and navigations into a 9 till 5 activity conducted from behind an office desk. If C&RT, or any of its its bank staff and lock keepers only want, or expect, to work from 9 till 5 for 5 days a week, . . they're in the wrong job ! There are restricted hours (not relating to tides) at Ocean Lock ...... they also get very sniffy if they are not given 24 hours notice as well (ABP) ABP get more bolshie and bloody-minded with every passing year. There was a time, . . and not all that long ago, . .when you just turned up, either in the river outside or in the Docks, and if there was enough tide in the river, Flood or Ebb, they just got on with it and penned you. I really don't understand the need for all this farting about with 'booking' in advance. What's the point in it, . . and what does it achieve. Same nonsense nowadays at Naburn, Selby, Keadby, Stockwith and Torksey, . . probably Cromwell too by now ! For the Ribble Link it's 5 days ! Why, for Christ's sake ?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2022 7:01:22 GMT
Because we're all noddy-boaters these days there is no NEED to boat ... it is simply a leisure activity ... and the demand to use the Millenium Ribble Link is not great enough to have staff available 24 hours a day.
The times change, and it has been suggested in many posts that the link operates as it always was intended to do ... a balance between costs, manpower and access.
Rog
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Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2022 7:09:27 GMT
18 votes
Perhaps indicates the level of interest even on this tiny forum membership ... even when we're told a vast army of silent members are definitely demanding greater access.
My guess is the revolution won't be starting today.
Rog
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