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Post by JohnV on Aug 22, 2022 7:20:36 GMT
Because we're all noddy-boaters these days there is no NEED to boat ... it is simply a leisure activity ... and the demand to use the Millenium Ribble Link is not great enough to have staff available 24 hours a day. The times change, and it has been suggested in many posts that the link operates as it always was intended to do ... a balance between costs, manpower and access. Rog sorry Roger ... Ocean lock is still used by commercial workboats and barges and they are still meant to give 24 hours notice ..... which can be sometimes be impossible.
I think a lot is that they have cut down on manpower to the extent that people have to be taken off other duties to work the lock, take the ropes, operate the bridges if required by height etc etc.
It can be the same on other rivers where the council is the operator, they ignore the right of navigation.
sometimes by sheer ignorance and sometimes by creeping lack of infrastructure maintenance.
To them it is a cost that they wish was not there and they are quite willing to ignore legal requirements in the fairly safe assumption that nobody can afford to take them on
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Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2022 7:22:58 GMT
Because we're all noddy-boaters these days there is no NEED to boat ... it is simply a leisure activity ... and the demand to use the Millenium Ribble Link is not great enough to have staff available 24 hours a day. The times change, and it has been suggested in many posts that the link operates as it always was intended to do ... a balance between costs, manpower and access. Rog sorry Roger ... Ocean lock is still used by commercial workboats and barges and they are still meant to give 24 hours notice ..... which can be sometimes be impossible.
I think a lot is that they have cut down on manpower to the extent that people have to be taken off other duties to work the lock, take the ropes, operate the bridges if required by height etc etc.
It can be the same on other rivers where the council is the operator, they ignore the right of navigation.
sometimes by sheer ignorance and sometimes by creeping lack of infrastructure maintenance.
To them it is a cost that they wish was not there and they are quite willing to ignore legal requirements in the fairly safe assumption that nobody can afford to take them on
I specifically referred to the Millenium Ribble Link. I have done so throughout . Rog ETA I've said many times that I have no personal experience of the MRL but I did read up extensively prior to dismissing the crossing. I would not dream of engaging in discussions on rivers, tides, sailing, commercial traffic etc. other than to ask questions
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Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2022 7:31:05 GMT
I don't know when, or how, the obligation to give 'refuge from the tide' first came about, or what weight of law it actually carries nowadays, . . but I do know that BWB and C&RT have met with little to no opposition to this particular aspect of the general move towards making the running and operating of waterways and navigations into a 9 till 5 activity conducted from behind an office desk.
If C&RT, or any of its its bank staff and lock keepers only want, or expect, to work from 9 till 5 for 5 days a week, . . they're in the wrong job !
My post was in response to yours quoted above.
You asked why C&RT were making boating a 9-5 job and I suggested (as others repeatedly have done so) a possible reason in relation to the MRL.
Rog
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Post by JohnV on Aug 22, 2022 7:32:28 GMT
sorry Roger ... Ocean lock is still used by commercial workboats and barges and they are still meant to give 24 hours notice ..... which can be sometimes be impossible.
I think a lot is that they have cut down on manpower to the extent that people have to be taken off other duties to work the lock, take the ropes, operate the bridges if required by height etc etc.
It can be the same on other rivers where the council is the operator, they ignore the right of navigation.
sometimes by sheer ignorance and sometimes by creeping lack of infrastructure maintenance.
To them it is a cost that they wish was not there and they are quite willing to ignore legal requirements in the fairly safe assumption that nobody can afford to take them on
I specifically referred to the Millenium Ribble Link. I have done so throughout . Rog there is a pattern Rog ..... just you (and many others) don't seem to see it
It's not an anti CRT thing any more than it is anti EA, it seems to be a general thing amongst authorities.
Maybe because the numbers and quantities of commercial traffic is so much smaller that they consider it a group they can safely ignore
but this gradual erosion of facilities and rights is what hampers a possible resurgence of commercial boating and is what seems to be contributing to it's eventual demise.
and I don't want it to happen before I have a chance to do a cargo run in a big barge up the canal
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Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2022 7:41:18 GMT
But ALL discussion here has been about the MILLENIUM RIBBLE LINK ... a way for noddy-boaters to travel in their so-called narrow boats to and from the Lancaster Canal. I don't see the pattern because it's not relevant to the MRL We keep being attacked as anti-commercial traffic or C&RT sympathisers when the discussion isn't about that. TonyDunkley and yourself have a huge knowledge and experience of commercial boating ... why not start a thread setting out the arguments against C&RT and see what level of interest and support you raise. The MRL is not and was never envisaged as a commercial route ... it's a tourist trip. Rog
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Post by Mr Stabby on Aug 22, 2022 7:46:16 GMT
The MRL is not and was never envisaged as a commercial route ... it's a tourist trip. Exactly that, and as I've pointed out you won't find Alton Towers theme park open on a Tuesday in November or February.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2022 7:53:52 GMT
And just to be clear, I'm not attacking you JohnV or TonyDunkley ... I just consider the issues you raise and are deeply concerned by don't actually relate to the MRL ... it's the bigger commercial traffic issue. Rog
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Post by JohnV on Aug 22, 2022 7:55:13 GMT
The MRL is not and was never envisaged as a commercial route ... it's a tourist trip. Exactly that, and as I've pointed out you won't find Alton Towers theme park open on a Tuesday in November or February. Rog was commenting on a TD reply to a post of mine and the majority of TD's post was to me and concerned ABP not CRT.
as I said, if you cannot see there is a pattern of behaviour by navigation authorities then you are not looking.
The Ribble Link is I agree an extreme outlier but if it is in fact not being operated using best practice then this is still an indicator of attitudes.
You might be commenting on Rogers post without reading all before but
it has never been even vaguely suggested by anybody that it was, is or ever could be a commercial route
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Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2022 8:06:53 GMT
How could we see the pattern JohnV ... as TonyDunkley always points out we're Noddy boaters. Why would we know details of the arguments you introduce ? But you're superimposing commercial traffic arguments onto the MRL tourist route and suggesting there's a pattern. The MRL operates as it always has for 20 years and as it was intended to ... no chipping away of rights ... no flexing of authority's muscles. Rog
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Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2022 8:13:24 GMT
Don't worry about it Rog, it's all just chuff gas.
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Post by JohnV on Aug 22, 2022 8:23:09 GMT
Don't worry about it Rog, it's all just chuff gas. just like most of your posts it seems
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Post by kris on Aug 22, 2022 8:29:51 GMT
Fight fight fight.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2022 8:31:49 GMT
I don't doubt yours, and Tony's and Gazza's concerns are real (the tides and traffic you speak of are a foreign country to me) and with good supporting evidence ... it's just that I suggest those arguments don't fit THE MRL.
Rog
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Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2022 8:33:28 GMT
Don't worry about it Rog, it's all just chuff gas. just like most of your posts it seems Just adding some context to the Ribble Stink debate
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Post by Deleted on Aug 22, 2022 10:21:34 GMT
I don't mind the discussion, it's the insults I don't like.
Rog
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