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Post by kris on Nov 1, 2023 14:41:45 GMT
Surely when you pay for a mooring the money goes to the mooring owner (marina, landowner or even C&RT if they're the owners). The money isn't going directly into the same pot as licensing and general maintenance so having a mooring or not doesn't increase anyone's contribution to maintaining facilities does it ? If we all pay a licence fee ... even if substantially increased ... what we do with our boat thereafter is surely personal choice. Whether that be using it as a holiday cottage, for weekend breaks or weeks away, or longer cruising. Some haven't the free time so need a mooring for part of the year. Some need to have a mooring all year and just occasionally cruise or indeed never cruise. This is personal choice and no one's contributing more or less than anyone else. Of course you can make a payment to C&RT by way of donation on a monthly basis, or arrange for a bequest in your will ... that's certainly extra. Rog While some does go to a landowner, the EOG fee, in my case, goes to CRT. Same for Marinas with an NAA with CRT, a portion goes to CRT. Why do you think that goes into a separate pot at CRT, I doubt it does. There is no disputing the fact that I contribute more to CRT, willingly, than a ccer. You pay more because you have access to a mooring. What can you not understand.
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Post by kris on Nov 1, 2023 14:43:07 GMT
They don't pay less Jim ... they pay the same as you. But you choose to pay extra for a mooring, same as kris and for three months at least, so do I. Rog Jim seems to have a problem understanding that he had access to more facilities ie a mooring so he has to pay more. I don’t know how to explain it to him any simpler.
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Post by dogless on Nov 1, 2023 14:50:06 GMT
I was looking at a C&RT mooring on the Ashby during the summer ... £1897 a year just for rings and the right to stay put. Not even vehicle access ... but it was in a farmer's field. I chose not to pay it. I do pay for a C&RT mooring for three months and choose to cruise the rest. I also make a donation to C&RT each month. I think Jim 's argument is simply based on not liking continuous cruisers. Rog
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Post by Telemachus on Nov 1, 2023 14:53:44 GMT
But you get more Jim ... a mooring. Rog But he, and I, pay the mooring owner for the use of the mooring. And then we pay another 10% directly to CRT, which goes into the same pot as the licence fee. Approaching £300 in our case. So CRT gets directly from us, about 30% more than a CCer with the same sized boat. Yes we get a mooring too, but there is no escaping that having paid the marina operator their fee to cover expenditure and profit, we also have to give CRT another £300.
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Post by Andyberg on Nov 1, 2023 14:54:28 GMT
Typical moaning OAP, there for the sympathy vote. These ‘poor OAP’s’ are raking it in with their heating and living allowances plus received a 10.1% increase last April & are expecting a further 8.2% this coming April. 🙄 If they cant afford an additional few % on their licence fee, I suggest they move onto land and experience some ‘increases’ realities! Moaning bunch of twunts! 👎
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Post by kris on Nov 1, 2023 14:55:08 GMT
You pay a higher amount for extra services the use of a mooring. If you choose not to use it that’s your choice. So you use the facilities as much as a cc’er. So explain to me how your subsidising anyone ? Again jim it’s your choice to have a mooring. Ps Jim I have a home mooring. So how am I not paying my fair share? There are no services whatsoever on my mooring, where did you get that idea. Fair enough if you are paying your share, are you happy to contribute to the feckless ccers who arent? I do use the services as much, almost, as a ccer, why should they pay less? I don’t think cc’ers are feckless. I refuse to buy into the divisive propaganda that crt insist on perpetrating. If boaters don’t stick together then the waterways have no chance. The extra service you pay for Jim is use of a mooring. Is that so difficult to understand? Personally I think crt should be concentrating on the increasing number of boats that have no licence no number no name. But these are too difficult to Persue. So they insist on chasing licence payers who haven’t moved the arbitrary amount. The low hanging fruit. In my experience the most vulnerable are the ones they tend to go for. When I was near nottingham they ignored six boats with no licence etc and picked on an 80 year old man with cancer who had been a good paying customer for over 20 years. They hounded him off the cut when his health got bad. Whilst the six boats with nothing are still there two years later. Unfortunately this is all to common
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Post by kris on Nov 1, 2023 14:56:50 GMT
But you get more Jim ... a mooring. Rog But he, and I, pay the mooring owner for the use of the mooring. And then we pay another 10% directly to CRT, which goes into the same pot as the licence fee. Approaching £300 in our case. So CRT gets directly from us, about 30% more than a CCer with the same sized boat. Yes we get a mooring too, but there is no escaping that having paid the marina operator their fee to cover expenditure and profit, we also have to give CRT another £300. Yes but you get something for the extra payment.
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Post by Jim on Nov 1, 2023 14:56:56 GMT
I was looking at a C&RT mooring on the Ashby during he summer ... £1897 a year just for rings and the right to stay put. Not even vehicle access. I chose not to pay it. I do pay for a C&RT mooring for three months and choose to cruise the rest. I also make a donation to C&RT each month. I think Jim 's argument is simply based on not liking continuous cruisers. Rog I have responsibilities, by choice, that mean I can't go boating all summer, you don't, that's fair enough. I have nothing at all against ccers, I just get fed up with the divisive whinging and campaining about contributing a fairer share overall to crt, which needs more dosh, as well as better management, for preemptive repairs etc. You are in a minority group dogless, though not one of the whiners and whingers. I also make a donation each month as you do.
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Post by Jim on Nov 1, 2023 15:00:03 GMT
But he, and I, pay the mooring owner for the use of the mooring. And then we pay another 10% directly to CRT, which goes into the same pot as the licence fee. Approaching £300 in our case. So CRT gets directly from us, about 30% more than a CCer with the same sized boat. Yes we get a mooring too, but there is no escaping that having paid the marina operator their fee to cover expenditure and profit, we also have to give CRT another £300. Yes but you get something for the extra payment. I have to pay for extra for every night on the canal, a ccer doesnt, how is that fair, we are both moored on crt waters. Perhaps the fairest way is to remove the crt mooring fee and up the licence so everyone pays equally to crt, depending on the size of their boat.
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Post by Telemachus on Nov 1, 2023 15:00:42 GMT
I was looking at a C&RT mooring on the Ashby during the summer ... £1897 a year just for rings and the right to stay put. Not even vehicle access ... but it was in a farmer's field. I chose not to pay it. I do pay for a C&RT mooring for three months and choose to cruise the rest. I also make a donation to C&RT each month. I think Jim 's argument is simply based on not liking continuous cruisers. Rog I can’t speak for Jim but my point is that CRT gets less money from CCers than they do from people with home moorings, even though the former as a group cost them more for water, rubbish disposal, septic tank emptying etc. CRT are seeking to correct this apparent anomaly and it’s hard to form a rational argument against it.
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Post by Jim on Nov 1, 2023 15:02:52 GMT
I was looking at a C&RT mooring on the Ashby during the summer ... £1897 a year just for rings and the right to stay put. Not even vehicle access ... but it was in a farmer's field. I chose not to pay it. I do pay for a C&RT mooring for three months and choose to cruise the rest. I also make a donation to C&RT each month. I think Jim 's argument is simply based on not liking continuous cruisers. Rog I can’t speak for Jim but my point is that CRT gets less money from CCers than they do from people with home moorings, even though the former as a group cost them more for water, rubbish disposal, septic tank emptying etc. CRT are seeking to correct this apparent anomaly and it’s hard to form a rational argument against it.though some are trying, very trying!
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Post by Telemachus on Nov 1, 2023 15:04:38 GMT
But he, and I, pay the mooring owner for the use of the mooring. And then we pay another 10% directly to CRT, which goes into the same pot as the licence fee. Approaching £300 in our case. So CRT gets directly from us, about 30% more than a CCer with the same sized boat. Yes we get a mooring too, but there is no escaping that having paid the marina operator their fee to cover expenditure and profit, we also have to give CRT another £300. Yes but you get something for the extra payment. What matters to CRT is how much money they get. They get less from CCers than they do from boats that never leave the marina. They don’t care whether or not a mooring gets chucked into the deal, it is only about their income.
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Post by dogless on Nov 1, 2023 15:05:13 GMT
But you get more Jim ... a mooring. Rog But he, and I, pay the mooring owner for the use of the mooring. And then we pay another 10% directly to CRT, which goes into the same pot as the licence fee. Approaching £300 in our case. So CRT gets directly from us, about 30% more than a CCer with the same sized boat. Yes we get a mooring too, but there is no escaping that having paid the marina operator their fee to cover expenditure and profit, we also have to give CRT another £300. That's an accidental bi-product of you, Jim and I paying for a mooring not specifically financial support for maintenance ... and in your case and mine how much goes to maintaining the moorings as opposed to C&RT maintenance ? The bulk I imagine. But that's not really the point ... the point is EVERY boat owner needs a licence. After that it's personal preference to suit ones needs. Rog
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Post by Telemachus on Nov 1, 2023 15:06:48 GMT
There are no services whatsoever on my mooring, where did you get that idea. Fair enough if you are paying your share, are you happy to contribute to the feckless ccers who arent? I do use the services as much, almost, as a ccer, why should they pay less? I don’t think cc’ers are feckless. I refuse to buy into the divisive propaganda that crt insist on perpetrating. If boaters don’t stick together then the waterways have no chance. The extra service you pay for Jim is use of a mooring. Is that so difficult to understand? Personally I think crt should be concentrating on the increasing number of boats that have no licence no number no name. But these are too difficult to Persue. So they insist on chasing licence payers who haven’t moved the arbitrary amount. The low hanging fruit. In my experience the most vulnerable are the ones they tend to go for. When I was near nottingham they ignored six boats with no licence etc and picked on an 80 year old man with cancer who had been a good paying customer for over 20 years. They hounded him off the cut when his health got bad. Whilst the six boats with nothing are still there two years later. Unfortunately this is all to common I would agree with most of that. Hounding people who have a licence off the cut, whilst allowing an increasing number of unlicensed boats, is not a good way to maximise your income.
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Post by Telemachus on Nov 1, 2023 15:14:00 GMT
But he, and I, pay the mooring owner for the use of the mooring. And then we pay another 10% directly to CRT, which goes into the same pot as the licence fee. Approaching £300 in our case. So CRT gets directly from us, about 30% more than a CCer with the same sized boat. Yes we get a mooring too, but there is no escaping that having paid the marina operator their fee to cover expenditure and profit, we also have to give CRT another £300. That's an accidental bi-product of you, Jim and I paying for a mooring not specifically financial support for maintenance ... and in your case and mine how much goes to maintaining the moorings as opposed to C&RT maintenance ? The bulk I imagine. But that's not really the point ... the point is EVERY boat owner needs a licence. After that it's personal preference to suit ones needs. Rog I think you are conflating two things. If it is a CRT owned and operated mooring then as you say, some unknown % will go maintaining the mooring. That will vary from site to site and year to year, but it seems unlikely to be a large %. However in the case of a non-CRT mooring such as most marinas, the 10% paid to CRT is pure “profit”, CRT has no expenditure other than admin and virtually all of it goes into their general pot.
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