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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2016 7:56:26 GMT
Our boat has side anodes. Hasn't lost any in several years. 2 pack seems to be worth the extra costs and effort it seems. Ian. Do they get caught on anything? |
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Post by cuthound on Nov 10, 2016 8:41:23 GMT
Anyway I should also mention that Telemachus has come home to Glascote basin - we are in the dry dock courtesy of Sarah of Norton Canes Boatbuilders who now runs the basin. Sarah and team have been nothing but friendly and helpful and seem to mostly do boat repairs etc (as opposed to building new boats), so I can recommend them. Yes, that is where I have DQ booked in. Very friendly and helpful and competitively priced against the local opposition too. |
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Post by cuthound on Nov 10, 2016 8:45:03 GMT
I have basic bitumen blacking every two years since 2005. Next year will be our seventh blacking. Being out of the water gives us chance to have everything checked out, and to do some painting. As a bit of a whittler I think I'd be unsettled by 6 years between checks. Not saying it's bad, just I'm a worrier, sorry. So ......is it cheaper to do the two pack and out every 6 years, than bitumen every two? Rog Pretty sure it would be for us in the WB as the cost of cranes in & out will be significantly more than a NB, as well as the amount of yards that have cranes big enough is somewhat limited taboot.  Betty, Ventnor Farm have a dry dock that can take widebeams. Cost was £300 for DQ''s survey a couple of years ago. Might be cheaper than craning? |
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Post by Telemachus on Nov 10, 2016 8:46:27 GMT
I have basic bitumen blacking every two years since 2005. Next year will be our seventh blacking. Being out of the water gives us chance to have everything checked out, and to do some painting. As a bit of a whittler I think I'd be unsettled by 6 years between checks. Not saying it's bad, just I'm a worrier, sorry. So ......is it cheaper to do the two pack and out every 6 years, than bitumen every two? Rog It's probably cheaper to bitumen every 2 years. The original blasting and 2-pac up to the gunnels was around £2600 done professionally. The "stuff" we've used (sigmacover 300) is around £85 per coat - were just putting on 1 coat. Covered dry dock ~£300 for the week. But the difference is that nearly all bitumened boats I see have some rust at the waterline before they get reblacked, and the stuff is thick so you end up with lumps and bumps and a significant thickness of gunge after several recoats (doesn't help skin tank functionality and just look a bit grotty IMO). Whereas the 2-pac boats look much better (also IMO). Then there is the hassle of arranging it all, personal time required etc and if you prepare the bitumen properly you really need to wire wheel it whereas with the 2-pac you sand it. Wire wheeling is pretty horrible and you get bits of wire everywhere including in your skin! so 2-pac may be more expensive but you get what you pay for. my view is that people only use bitumen because that's what they and everyone else have always done. If you started with a blank piece of paper and discarded habit, it would be a no brainier to have 2-pac on any newish boat. If you are buying a one for£100k+ it would be foolish to have it bitumened IMO. |
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Post by JohnV on Nov 10, 2016 8:48:23 GMT
I have basic bitumen blacking every two years since 2005. Next year will be our seventh blacking. Being out of the water gives us chance to have everything checked out, and to do some painting. As a bit of a whittler I think I'd be unsettled by 6 years between checks. Not saying it's bad, just I'm a worrier, sorry. So ......is it cheaper to do the two pack and out every 6 years, than bitumen every two? Rog Pretty sure it would be for us in the WB as the cost of cranes in & out will be significantly more than a NB, as well as the amount of yards that have cranes big enough is somewhat limited taboot. Betty, There are drydocks on tidal/coastal waters within range of a canal boat (in good weather conditions) ...... the Tidal Thames, Medway, Faversham Creek etc Plus many many more outside my area of personal knowledge |
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Post by peterboat on Nov 10, 2016 8:48:30 GMT
Mine was shot blasted and zingered just over a year and a half ago unfortunately the zinger blacking went silver!! No loss of protection but couldnt live with the look. I docked it this year powerwashed it and keelblacked it, the zinger was perfik even where I had run into things! [Zinger paid for my docking etc so no cost to me]
2 pack, zingering are all the way to go if you want your boat to last a long time its the lack of rust that makes me smile, just no deterioration at the waterline
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Post by JohnV on Nov 10, 2016 8:51:27 GMT
Pretty sure it would be for us in the WB as the cost of cranes in & out will be significantly more than a NB, as well as the amount of yards that have cranes big enough is somewhat limited taboot. Betty, There are drydocks on tidal/coastal waters within range of a canal boat (in good weather conditions) ...... the Tidal Thames, Medway, Faversham Creek etc Plus many many more outside my area of personal knowledge Just to add ......... the reason I suggested tidal/floating docks is that generally they have much better access to work (gritblast etc) under the hull as they are normally raised much higher. |
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Post by peterboat on Nov 10, 2016 9:07:48 GMT
I have basic bitumen blacking every two years since 2005. Next year will be our seventh blacking. Being out of the water gives us chance to have everything checked out, and to do some painting. As a bit of a whittler I think I'd be unsettled by 6 years between checks. Not saying it's bad, just I'm a worrier, sorry. So ......is it cheaper to do the two pack and out every 6 years, than bitumen every two? Rog It's probably cheaper to bitumen every 2 years. The original blasting and 2-pac up to the gunnels was around £2600 done professionally. The "stuff" we've used (sigmacover 300) is around £85 per coat - were just putting on 1 coat. Covered dry dock ~£300 for the week. But the difference is that nearly all bitumened boats I see have some rust at the waterline before they get reblacked, and the stuff is thick so you end up with lumps and bumps and a significant thickness of gunge after several recoats (doesn't help skin tank functionality and just look a bit grotty IMO). Whereas the 2-pac boats look much better (also IMO). Then there is the hassle of arranging it all, personal time required etc and if you prepare the bitumen properly you really need to wire wheel it whereas with the 2-pac you sand it. Wire wheeling is pretty horrible and you get bits of wire everywhere including in your skin! so 2-pac may be more expensive but you get what you pay for. my view is that people only use bitumen because that's what they and everyone else have always done. If you started with a blank piece of paper and discarded habit, it would be a no brainier to have 2-pac on any newish boat. If you are buying a one for£100k+ it would be foolish to have it bitumened IMO. Yet your boat is an expensive Hudson and was just blacked and mine was an expensive Johathon Wilson and it was done with one coat of comastic Boatbuilders cheap skates!!! |
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Post by Telemachus on Nov 10, 2016 9:12:30 GMT
It's probably cheaper to bitumen every 2 years. The original blasting and 2-pac up to the gunnels was around £2600 done professionally. The "stuff" we've used (sigmacover 300) is around £85 per coat - were just putting on 1 coat. Covered dry dock ~£300 for the week. But the difference is that nearly all bitumened boats I see have some rust at the waterline before they get reblacked, and the stuff is thick so you end up with lumps and bumps and a significant thickness of gunge after several recoats (doesn't help skin tank functionality and just look a bit grotty IMO). Whereas the 2-pac boats look much better (also IMO). Then there is the hassle of arranging it all, personal time required etc and if you prepare the bitumen properly you really need to wire wheel it whereas with the 2-pac you sand it. Wire wheeling is pretty horrible and you get bits of wire everywhere including in your skin! so 2-pac may be more expensive but you get what you pay for. my view is that people only use bitumen because that's what they and everyone else have always done. If you started with a blank piece of paper and discarded habit, it would be a no brainier to have 2-pac on any newish boat. If you are buying a one for£100k+ it would be foolish to have it bitumened IMO. Yet your boat is an expensive Hudson and was just blacked and mine was an expensive Johathon Wilson and it was done with one coat of comastic Boatbuilders cheap skates!!! Agreed! It was our first boat (previously we had always used someone else's - so much cheaper!) but if I knew then what I know now I'd have had it blasted and 2-pac'd from new. I did ask Steve about it mid-build but he said it would be very difficult as they didn't do blasting on site. We decided to live with the bitumen until it fell off (which it did fairly quickly!) and then go for the 2-pac. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2016 9:14:44 GMT
It's probably cheaper to bitumen every 2 years. The original blasting and 2-pac up to the gunnels was around £2600 done professionally. The "stuff" we've used (sigmacover 300) is around £85 per coat - were just putting on 1 coat. Covered dry dock ~£300 for the week. But the difference is that nearly all bitumened boats I see have some rust at the waterline before they get reblacked, and the stuff is thick so you end up with lumps and bumps and a significant thickness of gunge after several recoats (doesn't help skin tank functionality and just look a bit grotty IMO). Whereas the 2-pac boats look much better (also IMO). Then there is the hassle of arranging it all, personal time required etc and if you prepare the bitumen properly you really need to wire wheel it whereas with the 2-pac you sand it. Wire wheeling is pretty horrible and you get bits of wire everywhere including in your skin! so 2-pac may be more expensive but you get what you pay for. my view is that people only use bitumen because that's what they and everyone else have always done. If you started with a blank piece of paper and discarded habit, it would be a no brainier to have 2-pac on any newish boat. If you are buying a one for£100k+ it would be foolish to have it bitumened IMO. Yet your boat is an expensive Hudson and was just blacked and mine was an expensive Johathon Wilson and it was done with one coat of comastic Boatbuilders cheap skates!!! Ours is a cheap Les Allen, so just gets some bitumen every couple of years. |
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Post by cuthound on Nov 10, 2016 9:18:36 GMT
DQ was shotblasted, zinga'd and 2 packed from new. Then the previous owner has comastic applied every 2 years until we bought her. No rust visible at all a day the comastic applied in 2013 seems to be holding up well.
Talking to Sarah at Glascote, it may be best for us to continue with the comastic, if the 2 pack is still sound. If noth it'll be an expensive shotblast back to bare metal and redo the Zinga and 2 pack.
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Post by Telemachus on Nov 10, 2016 9:23:09 GMT
DQ was shotblasted, zinga'd and 2 packed from new. Then the previous owner has comastic applied every 2 years until we bought her. No rust visible at all a day the comastic applied in 2013 seems to be holding up well. Talking to Sarah at Glascote, it may be best for us to continue with the comastic, if the 2 pack is still sound. If noth it'll be an expensive shotblast back to bare metal and redo the Zinga and 2 pack. Yes in your case if the substrate is good, no point in starting again. But if your boat didn't have the zinga / 2-pac it would be a different matter. |
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Post by bettina on Nov 10, 2016 10:22:01 GMT
Pretty ... limited taboot. Betty, Ventnor Farm have a dry dock that can take widebeams. Cost was £300 for DQ''s survey a couple of years ago. Might be cheaper than craning? Brilliant idea, I never even considered a dry dock. My brain went directly to cranes. With Ventnor just being around the corner from Braunston, I know we can get there quite easily. Pretty sure it would be for us in the WB as the cost of cranes in & out will be significantly more than a NB, as well as the amount of yards that have cranes big enough is somewhat limited taboot. Betty, There are drydocks on tidal/coastal waters within range of a canal boat (in good weather conditions) ...... the Tidal Thames, Medway, Faversham Creek etc Plus many many more outside my area of personal knowledge LOL - John, I definitely don't have the nerve to even think about taking our boat out to Faversham or Medway. I refuse to let him take it down to the Houses of Parliament, which is something he'd really like to do. Call me a 'chicken shit' if you must, I'm ok with that  Just to add ......... the reason I suggested tidal/floating docks is that generally they have much better access to work (gritblast etc) under the hull as they are normally raised much higher. Again, good thinking......but I'm "bawk bawk bawk bawk, ba ba, bawk bawk" (now say that out loud whilst pretending your a feather animal usually found on a farm that pecks at grit on the ground for it's feed, and it's not a Turkey!)  |
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Post by cuthound on Nov 10, 2016 11:13:37 GMT
It had anodes front and rear (ie 4 total). When we had it blasted and 2-packed I thought that, since it wouldn't be out for 6 years, we'd better have another 4. However again, not sure we needed to have bothered since the original ones are only about 1/2 worn and the new ones hardly at all. Of course it's worth bearing in mind that the "sphere of influence" of an anode is not that great. They do however perhaps give early warning of electrolytic corrosion problems. I have often wondered why a boatbuilder has not fitted an anode in the form of a full length rubbing strake below the waterline. it could be secured by stainless steel bolts welded to the hull at regular intervals, with welded strap connections at the far ends if necessary . This would provide full length protection surely? Is there any reason why this cannot be done? |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 10, 2016 11:22:13 GMT
Thanks for the information.
Our boat is 23 years old, and only ever been blacked, but at least it's been done every two years. I guess it makes sense to stick with it now.
It was last out in 2015, and looked in good order. Roger Farrington examined it and was impressed with the condition. I suppose it helps that we spend virtually no time connected to the mains.
My friends 12 year old Liverpool boat by contrast, spends most of it's life 'hooked up' and was very badly pitted when it was out last year. He's now fitted a galvanic isolator (on advice) and gone to two pack.
The lack of hook up, or the quality of the steel, or something seems to be working on my boat. However I have to agree with you, that with a new boat I'd go for a better quality protective coat.
Rog
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