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Post by Gone on Nov 19, 2018 19:40:11 GMT
You will (by law) be allowed to use rebated diesel in your separate non propulsion tank. The change in rules from our eu friends is you must not put marked (red) rebated fuel into a tank that feeds a propulsion engine, and also that rebated fuel must be marked (usually red). So a fuel supplier will have to decide if they wish to sell, red or white diesel or buy a second system to be able to sell both. Can’t see many canal side suppliers making that sort of investment. Canalside or at least Riverside (Thames) suppliers already CBA. I just wonder if this will be a little boost for the fuel boats as the man on the boat has no way of knowing or giving a shit what you use the red diesel for. If he has arrived at your boat rather than you arrived at his its more than likely the fuel is going to be used for heating or electric. Maybe it will be a case of two fillers with labels. But to be able to sell both the fuel boat will have to have two separate systems one for red and one for white.
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Post by Mr Stabby on Nov 19, 2018 19:43:10 GMT
Will be interesting to see if we all have to have our tanks cleaned out to allow for 'enforcement testing'. I expect hmrc will dip as many tanks as boaters they currently challenge on the split they declare - basically none. HMRC will probably wait a couple of years for systems to self clean and then only check the piss takers. On a lightly used boat (out of the marina for a ten mile cruise a couple of weekends a year) it would take hundreds of years for the tank to be cleared of marker dye.
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Post by Mr Stabby on Nov 19, 2018 19:48:35 GMT
I knew somebody who filled his tank with a mixture of red diesel and brown diesel.
He got marooned.
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Post by ianali on Nov 19, 2018 19:50:05 GMT
Will be interesting to see if we all have to have our tanks cleaned out to allow for 'enforcement testing'. I expect hmrc will dip as many tanks as boaters they currently challenge on the split they declare - basically none. HMRC will probably wait a couple of years for systems to self clean and then only check the piss takers. Can’t believe they will bother doing random checks given the far greater tax cheats they would like to be investigating without enough inspectors. I expect the majority of fuel suppliers will only be selling white diesel. For me that’s what il be buying as when out cruising that’s what’s available.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 19, 2018 19:55:48 GMT
Canalside or at least Riverside (Thames) suppliers already CBA. I just wonder if this will be a little boost for the fuel boats as the man on the boat has no way of knowing or giving a shit what you use the red diesel for. If he has arrived at your boat rather than you arrived at his its more than likely the fuel is going to be used for heating or electric. Maybe it will be a case of two fillers with labels. But to be able to sell both the fuel boat will have to have two separate systems one for red and one for white. I would expect the fuel boats to only supply red for heating and electric use and let the customer worry about the tax shit.
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Post by naughtyfox on Nov 20, 2018 8:05:07 GMT
So what? Cost of fuel going up. Ask your employer for a salary increase! No, don't worry, surely he won't be looking at some East European to replace you... err... But surely everyone is missing the point? The result of the Brexit referendum was to tell Merkel and her corrupt cronies to piss off - why is Britain honouring EU 'laws' any more?
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Post by patty on Nov 20, 2018 9:55:32 GMT
Thing is all these organisations short staffed so unless they recruit cannot see major testing enforced without summit else being neglected. All these regulations just mean they rob Peter to pay Paul with regards enforcing them
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Post by peterboat on Nov 20, 2018 11:48:12 GMT
Will be interesting to see if we all have to have our tanks cleaned out to allow for 'enforcement testing'. I expect hmrc will dip as many tanks as boaters they currently challenge on the split they declare - basically none. HMRC will probably wait a couple of years for systems to self clean and then only check the piss takers. Can’t believe they will bother doing random checks given the far greater tax cheats they would like to be investigating without enough inspectors. I think you are right that and most of the suppliers will only be doing white, and I am sure all the other outlets will stop supplying red as well will seal the deal
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Post by peterboat on Nov 20, 2018 11:49:38 GMT
But to be able to sell both the fuel boat will have to have two separate systems one for red and one for white. I would expect the fuel boats to only supply red for heating and electric use and let the customer worry about the tax shit. I dont think they will be able to buy red which will sort it out nicely for the tax man
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Post by kris on Nov 20, 2018 12:05:23 GMT
I would expect the fuel boats to only supply red for heating and electric use and let the customer worry about the tax shit. I dont think they will be able to buy red which will sort it out nicely for the tax man I think you are right Peter, it will just become unavailable on the cut. Which will stop 90% or so from using it. Which will be seen as a good enough result. Time to finish my pyrolosis plant I think.
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Post by TonyDunkley on Nov 20, 2018 12:44:14 GMT
As any boats carrying and supplying coal, diesel and bog fluid are commercial boats and presumably will continue buying red diesel (gas oil) to run on themselves, the choice of what to supply to their customers will be theirs alone to make.
Personally speaking, if I was operating one of these boats, I would restrict myself to supplying only (red) gas oil for power generation and heating, and out of concern for my customer's safety and the shortcomings of the BSS with regard to best practice re. piping layout, primary and secondary filtering, and onboard/built-in fuel cleaning/re-circulating systems, I'd probably produce a small, informative leaflet on the subject.
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Post by peterboat on Nov 20, 2018 13:50:53 GMT
I have a tank at the boatyard {tullys old one] when I inquired about red diesel they didnt want to know, I have bought red diesel for years with no issues but now days it is getting more difficult. I can buy Kero because that can go into the whispergen and the bubble stove, and in the new year will buy 1000 litres, the plus side is its way cheaper than red and its cleaner in both my applications.
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Post by TonyDunkley on Nov 20, 2018 14:00:34 GMT
I have a tank at the boatyard {tullys old one] when I inquired about red diesel they didnt want to know, I have bought red diesel for years with no issues but now days it is getting more difficult. I can buy Kero because that can go into the whispergen and the bubble stove, and in the new year will buy 1000 litres, the plus side is its way cheaper than red and its cleaner in both my applications. <iframe width="21.019999999999982" height="3.5600000000000023" style="position: absolute; width: 21.019999999999982px; height: 3.5600000000000023px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none;left: 15px; top: -5px;" id="MoatPxIOPT0_78619271" scrolling="no"></iframe> <iframe width="21.019999999999982" height="3.5600000000000023" style="position: absolute; width: 21.02px; height: 3.56px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none; left: 994px; top: -5px;" id="MoatPxIOPT0_71066722" scrolling="no"></iframe> <iframe width="21.019999999999982" height="3.5600000000000023" style="position: absolute; width: 21.02px; height: 3.56px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none; left: 15px; top: 118px;" id="MoatPxIOPT0_86365986" scrolling="no"></iframe> <iframe width="21.019999999999982" height="3.5600000000000023" style="position: absolute; width: 21.02px; height: 3.56px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none; left: 994px; top: 118px;" id="MoatPxIOPT0_97083179" scrolling="no"></iframe> <iframe width="20.720000000000027" height="3.5600000000000023" style="position: absolute; width: 20.720000000000027px; height: 3.5600000000000023px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none;left: 15px; top: -5px;" id="MoatPxIOPT1_33615111" scrolling="no"></iframe> <iframe width="20.720000000000027" height="3.5600000000000023" style="position: absolute; width: 20.72px; height: 3.56px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none; left: 979px; top: -5px;" id="MoatPxIOPT1_13749799" scrolling="no"></iframe> <iframe width="20.720000000000027" height="3.5600000000000023" style="position: absolute; width: 20.72px; height: 3.56px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none; left: 15px; top: 118px;" id="MoatPxIOPT1_45472640" scrolling="no"></iframe> <iframe width="20.720000000000027" height="3.5600000000000023" style="position: absolute; width: 20.72px; height: 3.56px; z-index: -9999; border-style: none; left: 979px; top: 118px;" id="MoatPxIOPT1_56554672" scrolling="no"></iframe> Question is though, Peter, does Kero still work out cheaper than gas oil after you've added the necessary 1% - 2% lube oil to it to protect the F.I. equipment from the greater rates of wear that neat Kero gives ?
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Post by kris on Nov 20, 2018 14:04:14 GMT
Last time I looked kerosene was 50p/lt on 500lts. So I would have thought it's still cheaper even after adding oil. Well it will be if you follow gardners instructions.
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Post by TonyDunkley on Nov 20, 2018 14:14:08 GMT
Last time I looked kerosene was 50p/lt on 500lts. So I would have thought it's still cheaper even after adding oil. Well it will be if you follow gardners instructions. What was gas oil in comparison at that time, kris ?
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