|
Post by kris on Apr 11, 2019 8:48:26 GMT
The point I was making with this thread is before the widebeam debacle the iwa was banging on about the widebeam "problem" low and behold crt's policy follows the direction of the IWA's rhetoric. So how long before cart release a statement proposing something similar to what the iwa are moaning about now.
|
|
|
Post by naughtyfox on Apr 11, 2019 8:49:01 GMT
So far, yes, in the hope that what we donate goes towards coffee and tea and biscuits for the volunteers who clean up the canals and surroundings.
|
|
|
Post by kris on Apr 11, 2019 8:49:56 GMT
It's the same authority every where in the republic. I didn’t realise they just had the one authority for the whole of Ireland. We did some of the Shannon Erne about 10 years ago on what was a bit like a cross between a widebeam and small barge. .Very pretty up there and enjoyed the lake sections. The only way I could tell we had ventured into the North was when my mobile provider changed! When I visited Dublin a few years back I was quite surprised by of the lack of boats generally and thought that the river through Dublin was a bit bland really. Great place for pubs though. We went to the German Beer Fest there, great fun. Re read what I have written I think the word you have missed is REPUBLIC. You just didn't know where to look in Dublin,although obviously there are less boats in Ireland as the population is much less.
|
|
|
Post by kris on Apr 11, 2019 8:53:17 GMT
So far, yes, in the hope that what we donate goes towards coffee and tea and biscuits for the volunteers who clean up the canals and surroundings. So you agree with the IWA's rhetoric then.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 11, 2019 9:26:08 GMT
I didn’t realise they just had the one authority for the whole of Ireland. We did some of the Shannon Erne about 10 years ago on what was a bit like a cross between a widebeam and small barge. .Very pretty up there and enjoyed the lake sections. The only way I could tell we had ventured into the North was when my mobile provider changed! When I visited Dublin a few years back I was quite surprised by of the lack of boats generally and thought that the river through Dublin was a bit bland really. Great place for pubs though. We went to the German Beer Fest there, great fun. Re read what I have written I think the word you have missed is REPUBLIC. You just didn't know where to look in Dublin,although obviously there are less boats in Ireland as the population is much less. I did read your post correctly, I’m just pointing out that I didn’t realise the one navigation authority covers all of Ireland. www.waterwaysireland.org/about-us/overviewAccording to the IWAI web site only 60 out of 10,000 boats are live aboards www.iwai.ie/liveaboards/
|
|
|
Post by wellyftw on Apr 11, 2019 9:41:39 GMT
As someone who has just spent the past two years in London, it is fair to say that London has a boating problem, but that said I never once had a problem finding somewhere to moor. If I couldn't find a mooring in an area I planned to moor up, then I'd just keep going.
However, places like King's Cross can be a bit of a shitshow when you get boats triple mooring. And it's not because there isn't anywhere to moor up - there are plenty of places to moor further along in placed like Harlesden and Scrubs Lane and further on, in fact they've stuck a load of mooring rings just past Scrubs Lane almost all the way to Harlesden - it's because those who triple moor can't be bothered to move on or they want to be central. It's not as if it's not difficult to get to central London from further out west.
There is a problem in London, and I don't think the IWAs solution is a solution, the solution is better/stronger enforcement and getting boaters to go further than the 6 mile (or thereabouts) range between Little Venice and Hackney. If I was still in London, part of me would think "don't encourage people to head out west, it's nice and quiet out there and I can get a mooring every time" but on the other hand if the CRT are going to cowtow the IWA and implement their stupid ideas then the CRT needs to get enforcing movement.
Of course, as I understand it, now they have only one enforcement officer in London covering from Oxford to the south east, that'll never happen.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 11, 2019 9:54:02 GMT
Increasing the cost of using a popular resource which is heavily oversubscribed is basic economics.
I don't really understand why people think the canals somehow escape this.
I don't want it to happen personally but I don't see why it wouldn't happen.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 11, 2019 10:34:18 GMT
As someone who has just spent the past two years in London, it is fair to say that London has a boating problem, but that said I never once had a problem finding somewhere to moor. If I couldn't find a mooring in an area I planned to moor up, then I'd just keep going. However, places like King's Cross can be a bit of a shitshow when you get boats triple mooring. And it's not because there isn't anywhere to moor up - there are plenty of places to moor further along in placed like Harlesden and Scrubs Lane and further on, in fact they've stuck a load of mooring rings just past Scrubs Lane almost all the way to Harlesden - it's because those who triple moor can't be bothered to move on or they want to be central. It's not as if it's not difficult to get to central London from further out west. There is a problem in London, and I don't think the IWAs solution is a solution, the solution is better/stronger enforcement and getting boaters to go further than the 6 mile (or thereabouts) range between Little Venice and Hackney. If I was still in London, part of me would think "don't encourage people to head out west, it's nice and quiet out there and I can get a mooring every time" but on the other hand if the CRT are going to cowtow the IWA and implement their stupid ideas then the CRT needs to get enforcing movement. Of course, as I understand it, now they have only one enforcement officer in London covering from Oxford to the south east, that'll never happen. The problem with this ‘moving’ thing is that it’s a lose lose. Those who use a boat purely to live on may not want the hassle of moving just to comply with the law. It also breaks up the liveaboard communities. From CRT’s perspective movement just wears out the locks and uses up resources for monitoring and enforcement. I think the ideal solution is to redevelop more areas to create more permanent moorings for liveaboards. I’m not sure whether there are any areas left in London for this kind of development though. I’m sure the vast majority of those on low incomes who want to live and work in London wouldn’t choose to live on a boat anyway. Why would they when they can have all mod cons in a flat? It’s only weirdos like me who want to live on a boat.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 11, 2019 10:44:51 GMT
The IWA is also into doing more permanent moorings and have identified a lot of sites.
One of the problems I think will come up is that people may be on boats simply because it is cheap (in London). If and when the costs go up (market rate £10k mooring fee) suddenly living on boats will be less attractive and demand will evaporate.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 11, 2019 11:00:00 GMT
The IWA is also into doing more permanent moorings and have identified a lot of sites. One of the problems I think will come up is that people may be on boats simply because it is cheap (in London). If and when the costs go up (market rate £10k mooring fee) suddenly living on boats will be less attractive and demand will evaporate. From what I understood you can get income support to live on a boat as you can for a flat. The thing is that you posh lot in London need to accommodate people who work in pubs, restaurants, cafes, bars, venues, etc.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 11, 2019 11:06:18 GMT
I never go to any of those places so you can remove the "you" Yes you can get housing benefit for moorings but I bet you'd find if people were in a position to claim HB they would chose a flat not a boat. Some people would choose boats but I think it would be a minority. I think people might be misunderstanding the population demographic living on boats in London. Its not a story of poverty.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 11, 2019 11:17:26 GMT
I never go to any of those places so you can remove the "you" Yes you can get housing benefit for moorings but I bet you'd find if people were in a position to claim HB they would chose a flat not a boat. I think people might be misunderstanding the population demographic living on boats in London. Maybe. I did the Thames ring again last year but admittingly haven’t been up the Paddington arm yet in a boat. I have come across quite a few boaters who have moved out of London and moved outside the M 25 corridor. So I guess that shows that for many, the London liveaboard situation has reached saturation point. At the end of the day, if there is nowhere to legitimately moor then any potential live aboards have the choice of moving further out or giving up thier dream.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 11, 2019 11:30:05 GMT
I don't buy into it being a dream.
Its a cheap housing option.
Not rocket science.
The nbta freely admit that it is a suitable alternative to squatting which has become more awkward due to law changes. The next thing which will become more awkward due to changes will be living on boats.
I think you are right to be concerned that it will not just be London which is affected it will be everywhere.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 11, 2019 11:50:37 GMT
I think you are right to be concerned that it will not just be London which is affected it will be everywhere. That’s your view MM, not mine. The point I’m trying to make is that when people realise it’s not practical to live on a boat so they can work and live in London, most wlll give up and move into a flat, maybe to somewhere other than the London area. I never bought into this idea that the whole waterways system will become a linear housing estate. Yes some have found a way to make it work by moving further out but I don’t think it’s on the scale you seem to think. I spend a lot of time cruising up and down the GU and Oxford in between bigger trips. I’ve not seen a huge change in 7 years. London, yes, it is reaching saturation.
|
|
|
Post by kris on Apr 11, 2019 11:59:06 GMT
The nbta freely admit that it is a suitable alternative to squatting which has become more awkward due to law changes. The next thing which will become more awkward due to changes will be living on boats. Have you got a link to this , so I can read up?
|
|