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Post by JohnV on May 9, 2016 6:11:00 GMT
Conversly Kriss, I find that some people's suspicions of authorities is so ingrained, that whenever one does anything that that is different or that they do not agree with, they instantly cry conspiracy. Probably the truth lies between.
I cannot accept that such a convoluted scheme, as has been described, can be attributed to a deliberate policy by CRT without two things. The first, some major tactical advantage that it would give CRT management that would be worth the risk. The second, some evidence that it is a deliberate act across multiple sectors.
I would accept that presently there are indicators that boaters are no longer being considered as the prime customers of CRT and that it is moving away from being primarily a navigation authority. This however is a different thing from presuming a deliberate course of action to rid themselves of a complete group of customers.
With the remit they have been given it is obvious that many other interests are going to get a higher priority than they used to. That means of course that other groups , that being us, will , to a certain extent, lose out. To be honest although I wish it wasn't so, it is inevitable, when a lot of the finance is coming from the common purse.
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Post by Deleted on May 9, 2016 6:37:57 GMT
Conversly Kriss, I find that some people's suspicions of authorities is so ingrained, that whenever one does anything that that is different or that they do not agree with, they instantly cry conspiracy. Probably the truth lies between. I cannot accept that such a convoluted scheme, as has been described, can be attributed to a deliberate policy by CRT without two things. The first, some major tactical advantage that it would give CRT management that would be worth the risk. The second, some evidence that it is a deliberate act across multiple sectors. I would accept that presently there are indicators that boaters are no longer being considered as the prime customers of CRT and that it is moving away from being primarily a navigation authority. This however is a different thing from presuming a deliberate course of action to rid themselves of a complete group of customers. With the remit they have been given it is obvious that many other interests are going to get a higher priority than they used to. That means of course that other groups , that being us, will , to a certain extent, lose out. To be honest although I wish it wasn't so, it is inevitable, when a lot of the finance is coming from the common purse. I think your totally right with the above John and I would only add that peoples suspicion of authority can be and generally is a good thing. I would rather have those people than be without them.
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Post by kris on May 9, 2016 7:53:15 GMT
I sometimes wish I could think the same John, but unfortunately I have to believe the evidence of my own eyes and ears.
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Post by kris on May 9, 2016 8:04:41 GMT
It's not a conspiracy John, it's implementation of an agenda that doesn't have a place for livaboard boaters in it. They are taking a gamble basically that they will be able to replace the lost income from boat liscences, with charitable donations and income from posh property developers. I suppose taking into account the decrease in maintance costs the sums add up on a spread sheet. But this is not taking into account the effect on people's lifes. But isn't that all to common in the modern world.
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Post by peterboat on May 9, 2016 8:15:21 GMT
I am seeing something different up here, maintenance is on the up, spot dredging [tanker draws a lot of water] locks always working, grass and trees cut back. Then there is the big rebuilding on the recently flooded canals, who knows how much this is all costing but I am grateful for all CRTs work on the Northern canal network
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Post by loafer on May 9, 2016 9:12:22 GMT
It is often said of me that I don't live in the 'real world', but I too struggle to see just where CRT are trying to drive me off the water. I see none of that, whereas I do see an increasing maintenance presence here and there.
When the Liveaboard Prevention Officer turns up to chain me to a marina pontoon, maybe I'll start to see what you whingers are on about!
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Post by Deleted on May 9, 2016 9:18:29 GMT
I am seeing something different up here, maintenance is on the up, spot dredging [tanker draws a lot of water] locks always working, grass and trees cut back. Then there is the big rebuilding on the recently flooded canals, who knows how much this is all costing but I am grateful for all CRTs work on the Northern canal network Vince Moran instigated what you are seeing in the North at the moment. In 2014, he set out a budget that would see money ploughed into the northern canals after being neglected year on year previously. Vince has now retired, which has lost CRT the only person at senior management who actually knew anything about canals. He took over the helm as CEO when Robin Evans left, and I feel the trustees made a huge mistake by not keeping him in that position. I can't remember if the programme for these funds in the North were three, or five years. I'm not sure what plans are going to be implemented after the period.
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Post by peterboat on May 9, 2016 9:42:05 GMT
I am seeing something different up here, maintenance is on the up, spot dredging [tanker draws a lot of water] locks always working, grass and trees cut back. Then there is the big rebuilding on the recently flooded canals, who knows how much this is all costing but I am grateful for all CRTs work on the Northern canal network Vince Moran instigated what you are seeing in the North at the moment. In 2014, he set out a budget that would see money ploughed into the northern canals after being neglected year on year previously. Vince has now retired, which has lost CRT the only person at senior management who actually knew anything about canals. He took over the helm as CEO when Robin Evans left, and I feel the trustees made a huge mistake by not keeping him in that position. I can't remember if the programme for these funds in the North were three, or five years. I'm not sure what plans are going to be implemented after the period. Well I for one am grateful to him, to often in the past 3 - 4 hours would be spent waiting for a lock keeper to pen us through now its a joy
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Post by tadworth on May 9, 2016 12:26:50 GMT
When the Liveaboard Prevention Officer turns up to chain me to a marina pontoon, maybe I'll start to see what you whingers are on about! That sounds very close to " i dont care unless if affects me " ?
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Post by peterboat on May 9, 2016 13:57:57 GMT
When the Liveaboard Prevention Officer turns up to chain me to a marina pontoon, maybe I'll start to see what you whingers are on about! That sounds very close to " i dont care unless if affects me " ? I read it as I am not seeing what you are seeing
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Post by Higgs on May 9, 2016 18:02:41 GMT
Over staying is not a major problem, its a vehicle CRT are using to bring in charging, and make boaters think they they were forced to do it. CRT need a whole host of powers to create a micro managed pay as you go leisure industry out of the canal system, unfortunately the legislation has none of them, they are going to abuse the crap out of it until they can get a new act in place. If they break bylaws or act in contempt of the legislation the worst that can happen is they are told to stop doing X and Y by a judicial review. It is not an offence for CRT to be in breach of its own bylaws !
CRT are already widely abusing their powers, or rather, they are getting marinas to abuse their powers. I don't think they would ever be able to get legislation passed that would make legitimate what they are doing . CRT would be opening a can of worms to suggest a pay as you go scheme. It would draw attention to a present scheme CRT run, through marinas, that charge for non use of CRT facilities.
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Post by loafer on May 9, 2016 18:10:23 GMT
When the Liveaboard Prevention Officer turns up to chain me to a marina pontoon, maybe I'll start to see what you whingers are on about! That sounds very close to " i dont care unless if affects me " ? It depends why it doesn't affect me. I think in this case, I just don't find what you describe, so no, I don't care. When I 'get it', maybe I'll care some more!
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Post by naughtyfox on May 9, 2016 19:15:37 GMT
Talking of happy...anyone else love the Cadbury's advert with the cat,dog & Barry White music? It makes me smile every time.Sometimes we need to take a step back & think about what is good in our lives. Trina No. All of Cadbury's management deserve to be hung, drawn and quartered and their eyes to be left dangling on Christmas trees for kicking their workers out of jobs in Birmingham and shifting their manufacturing to Poland, and for desecrating their chocolate by reducing the cocoa and adding sugar. I would like to see THAT made into an advertisement.
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Post by tadworth on May 9, 2016 19:22:24 GMT
That sounds very close to " i dont care unless if affects me " ? It depends why it doesn't affect me. I think in this case, I just don't find what you describe, so no, I don't care. When I 'get it', maybe I'll care some more! It would be interesting to know why you think CRT have set up a proceedure for "authorising" overstays, and added a section to their patrol notice to charge for overstaying, installed charge notices at various VM's and said publically that they had no plans to charge anyone, and decreed that a VM is a now a facility and therefore can be legally charged for ?
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Post by Deleted on May 9, 2016 19:29:59 GMT
It depends why it doesn't affect me. I think in this case, I just don't find what you describe, so no, I don't care. When I 'get it', maybe I'll care some more! It would be interesting to know why you think CRT have set up a proceedure for "authorising" overstays, and added a section to their patrol notice to charge for overstaying, installed charge notices at various VM's and said publically that they had no plans to charge anyone, and decreed that a VM is a now a facility and therefore can be legally charged for Are they proposing to charge for VM or just the overstay on the VM ?
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