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Post by TonyDunkley on Sept 4, 2017 21:58:23 GMT
It's likely that new seals in the throttle housing will cure the leak on a marine engine, but occasionally it turns out that the spindle bore in the ally throttle housing itself wears beyond the point where new seals alone will do the job. If there is much detectable side play/clearance of the spindle in the housing then it's well worth tracking down and fitting a new or good used one. As a vehicle engine, subject to far more numerous and extensive throttle operations/movements than a boat engine, the 4.108's that Ford used in the early Transits were well known for leaking fuel from badly worn pump throttle housings after covering fairly high mileages. This is the best pump side photo I can find if a Perkins 4.108M lowline - it's identical to dad's. I shall go armed with spare nuts as it's almost inevitable I'll drop one in the depths if i don't! Unless Perkins changed anything on those later engines, the three pump securing nuts are plain 5/16'' UNF. There was a flat and a spring washer under each one, . . . so I'd take a few of those along as well.
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Post by JohnV on Sept 4, 2017 22:04:43 GMT
It's likely that new seals in the throttle housing will cure the leak on a marine engine, but occasionally it turns out that the spindle bore in the ally throttle housing itself wears beyond the point where new seals alone will do the job. If there is much detectable side play/clearance of the spindle in the housing then it's well worth tracking down and fitting a new or good used one. As a vehicle engine, subject to far more numerous and extensive throttle operations/movements than a boat engine, the 4.108's that Ford used in the early Transits were well known for leaking fuel from badly worn pump throttle housings after covering fairly high mileages. I shall go armed with spare nuts as it's almost inevitable I'll drop one in the depths if i don't! Hee Hee Hee !!! Sunday was working on the Wylie gear on the top of a crane barge ...... was very glad I took a selection of odd nuts and bolts with me ...... lost 2 down into the guts of the crane but had the right ones in the tool bag !!! (working off some of the drydock fees )
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Post by Deleted on Sept 5, 2017 6:06:40 GMT
This is the best pump side photo I can find if a Perkins 4.108M lowline - it's identical to dad's. I shall go armed with spare nuts as it's almost inevitable I'll drop one in the depths if i don't! Unless Perkins changed anything on those later engines, the three pump securing nuts are plain 5/16'' UNF. There was a flat and a spring washer under each one, . . . so I'd take a few of those along as well. I've a handy box of odds and sods that will be coming with me, I'll double check there are some 5/16 UNf nuts in there though. Cheers.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 5, 2017 6:08:51 GMT
I shall go armed with spare nuts as it's almost inevitable I'll drop one in the depths if i don't! Hee Hee Hee !!! Sunday was working on the Wylie gear on the top of a crane barge ...... was very glad I took a selection of odd nuts and bolts with me ...... lost 2 down into the guts of the crane but had the right ones in the tool bag !!! (working off some of the drydock fees ) There are times I am glad I don't work on an oil rig! Gravity,It can be a bastard sometimes!
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Post by Clinton Cool on Sept 8, 2017 17:31:18 GMT
Update on this: the yard dropped the engine back in this morning, they allowed me to put all the bits back on it, save some cash. I don't really know what I'm doing but worked from memory, from when I took it all apart. Some bits were a bastard to get back on but perseverence sorted it out. Finally had it all back together, wired up, new coolant in, ready to give it a go. Initially it struggled but then I realised I hadn't turned the fuel tap back on Tried again, the engine fired up and ran sweetly. Sorted! or so I thought. However: I then noticed a steady drip of coolant on around the middle of the starter motor. I've had to trash 2 starter motors over the past 4 years because of water getting on them. The first one was a leak from the pipe between the heat exchanger and the thermostat housing. The second was down to an ill fitting filler cap on top of the heat exchanger, I replaced this. I can't feel any water in the area of the thermostat housing, I have a new gasket there. Also a new gasket between the heat exchanger and the engine body. My best guess is that either the hose that fits into the back of the heat exchanger, and goes to the skin tank, has split or otherwise, I didn't tighten the clamp that holds this pipe to the heat exchanger properly. I thought I had, but maybe not, can't think what else it might be. So, I think I'm going to have to take the heat exchanger off in the morning to investigate. It's frustrating, but at least I'm most of the way there now.
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Post by patty on Sept 8, 2017 17:37:03 GMT
sounding very positive...
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Post by thebfg on Sept 8, 2017 17:37:48 GMT
so some good news. at least it's running.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 8, 2017 20:27:51 GMT
Well done you.
Rog
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Post by naughtyfox on Sept 9, 2017 5:40:34 GMT
So what was wrong with the engine? Piston rings seized? Have you replaced pistons, cylinder liners and rings? Or is it just a new gasket (set)?
With the engine already out it would have been a good opportunity to strip it all down and replace all the bearings worth doing.
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Post by Clinton Cool on Sept 9, 2017 6:24:44 GMT
The piston rings were completely stuck, carbon rather than rust, and the head gasket was shot. The pistons themselves were fine, once new rings were fitted. The bore was immaculate, no signs of any scoring, no lips. The mechanic said it looked brand new. I don't readily have the several thousand pounds it would have cost to completely strip and check the engine. There was no obvious bearing noise, taking the head off didn't reveal any movement in anything that shouldn't have had any. At the end of the day a new engine is £4750, didn't see the value in spending two thirds or three quarters of this amount checking over what appeared to be OK. If stripping had revealed any horrors, parts are so expensive (94 quid for 1 set of piston rings) the overall cost would likely have exceeded the cost of fitting a brand new engine. Hopefully this fix will last a good few years but at the end of the day we don't really know, we make our decisions, take our chances!
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Post by JohnV on Sept 9, 2017 6:35:28 GMT
The piston rings were completely stuck, carbon rather than rust, and the head gasket was shot. The pistons themselves were fine, once new rings were fitted. The bore was immaculate, no signs of any scoring, no lips. The mechanic said it looked brand new. I don't readily have the several thousand pounds it would have cost to completely strip and check the engine. There was no obvious bearing noise, taking the head off didn't reveal any movement in anything that shouldn't have had any. At the end of the day a new engine is £4750, didn't see the value in spending two thirds or three quarters of this amount checking over what appeared to be OK. If stripping had revealed any horrors, parts are so expensive (94 quid for 1 set of piston rings) the overall cost would likely have exceeded the cost of fitting a brand new engine. Hopefully this fix will last a good few years but at the end of the day we don't really know, we make our decisions, take our chances! sounds like a very sensible decision to me !!! Well done you !!! Stuck rings but low wear sounds like a lot of running off load and/or the temperature of the engine not reaching the correct level. I am not an engine expert by any means but that sounds like lots of running cold to me. (Possibly Tony or Gazza could comment.)
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Post by Clinton Cool on Sept 9, 2017 7:00:14 GMT
The mechanic suggested that. I rarely use the engine for battery charging as I have a decent solar array and prefer to use a genny in the winter. Maybe the previous owner did though. I did get black smoke when I approached maximum revs, I suppose black smoke equals carbon?
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Post by peterboat on Sept 9, 2017 9:34:54 GMT
I take it the bores were glaze busted? if not the rings wont bed in and oil consumption will be high, its also possibly what went wrong last time
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Post by Clinton Cool on Sept 9, 2017 10:05:30 GMT
I take it the bores were glaze busted? if not the rings wont bed in and oil consumption will be high, its also possibly what went wrong last time I don't know really. The mechanic said the bores were pristine, that's all I know.
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Post by Clinton Cool on Sept 9, 2017 10:08:42 GMT
The water leak was where the hose joins the back of the heat exchanger. I'd fastened the hose clip down tight, but obviously not tight enough. Managed to get an extra 1/4 turn on it, seems to have done the job, dry as a bone now. Tricky getting the heat exchanger off with the thermostat housing in place, then getting it back together without losing the gasket, but job done I think.
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