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Post by peterboat on Feb 9, 2019 11:13:37 GMT
So this week we had the first trip on Joyce under electric power, for the technical maned I have used a 48 volt DC series motor its 12 inch in diameter and about 14 inches long, it has a cooling fan, it used to live in a large forklift truck as the drive motor I am running it at 70 volts with a curtis controller, reverse is achieved by using a reverse contacter by albright [it reverses the field windings] these motors have huge torque from 1 rpm upwards, for safety it has a 300 amp cutoff if something goes wrong with wiring or my propeller gets fouled it trips. The first trip was about 2 miles with maneuvering at each end, its very easy to drive the boat as the motor which is direct drive can spin at 30 rpm or right up to 1800 rpm. The boat is very quick off the mark and slows very well as well, at 3 MPH its drawing 50 amps ish 3.3KW on the meter which on its 280 AH batter bank gives it 5 hours ish on batteries. I also have 3.6 KW of solar so on sunny days it will run from the sun. The run lasted about an hour and was deemed a success, however I have to take it all to pieces to make it BSS proof and the rectify a couple of issues. The motor was at 72 degrees after an hour so I am also adding a blower to force more air through the motor for cooling, and the flange I turned is a fraction off center which causes a slight vibration, the mounts and center flex take these out, but I would rather sort it out properly.
As yet I am still having problems with CRT over the license because it 25% cheaper but that should be sorted soon, a CRT lockie who saw me on the run was amazed, and thought because of the lack of noise and smoke that I had an engine problem., a quick gander in the motor bay made him smile.
Remember my boat weighs 30 odd tons and used to be pushed along by 50 hp now its done by 7.5 hp but lots of torque and is lovely and quiet perfik
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Post by JohnV on Feb 9, 2019 11:17:42 GMT
huge step into the unknown ...... my hat's off to you
Enormous investment in time, money and skull sweat ...... so pleased to hear that it is going so well
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Post by kris on Feb 9, 2019 11:28:55 GMT
As yet I am still having problems with CRT over the license because it 25% cheaper but that should be sorted soon, a CRT lockie who saw me on the run was amazed, and thought because of the lack of noise and smoke that I had an engine problem., a quick gander in the motor bay made him smile.
Remember my boat weighs 30 odd tons and used to be pushed along by 50 hp now its done by 7.5 hp but lots of torque and is lovely and quiet perfik
What problems? there shouldn't be an issue surely. If it's electric then it's electric.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 9, 2019 12:06:51 GMT
Sounds good. I'd like to put electric in my 40x9 inspection launch. Its got very fine underwater lines so does not need much power. The trouble is it would be criminal to take out the mint condition Perkins P4. So I'm wondering about a pod in the rudder. Or maybe a motor belted to the tail shaft with a magnetic clutch. not sure if the PRM160 box will appreciate rotational input from the wrong end. I wouldn't take the diesel out as it gives good range and when boating I do long hours. Electric would be for close quarters like locks and quiet slow cruises.
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Post by bodger on Feb 9, 2019 12:08:13 GMT
great news.
When I am gently wafting along with my Minnkota powered 20ft lightweight cruiser I'll be glad that there is another enthusiast on the water.
Based on my experience with my previous 16ft yogurt pot, I expect to draw 0.5kW and achieve 4mph in the new boat which will be ready for launching in a couple of months. A different scale of power altogether but the principle is the same - I enjoy silent cruising, watching the wildlife that is unaware of my presence, and find it so easy to relax and not be concerned about speed or progress. My cruising ground is the Thames and I smugly watch the overpowered gin palaces racing past to get to the next lock - they really have no concept of the real pleasures of the river.
How do you charge your batteries if you are on a longer trip away from the home base?
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Post by peterboat on Feb 9, 2019 12:58:24 GMT
great news. When I am gently wafting along with my Minnkota powered 20ft lightweight cruiser I'll be glad that there is another enthusiast on the water. Based on my experience with my previous 16ft yogurt pot, I expect to draw 0.5kW and achieve 4mph in the new boat which will be ready for launching in a couple of months. A different scale of power altogether but the principle is the same - I enjoy silent cruising, watching the wildlife that is unaware of my presence, and find it so easy to relax and not be concerned about speed or progress. My cruising ground is the Thames and I smugly watch the overpowered gin palaces racing past to get to the next lock - they really have no concept of the real pleasures of the river. How do you charge your batteries if you are on a longer trip away from the home base? 3.6 KW of solar on the roof is how I charge up, in winter I can pop down to Kilnhurst and back or Sheffield and back. Summer time well if its sunny I suppose 6 hours is achievable, but by then I am bored and want a walk
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Post by bodger on Feb 9, 2019 13:31:15 GMT
I have nominally the same solar capacity as I consume when cruising, which is mathematically similar to you, but I can only cruise for 6 hours before I need a recharge, and I only cruise in sunny weather. Because I trail my boat and am retired I can plan my trips based on the weather forecasts. I always need a mains hook-up every evening.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 9, 2019 13:57:10 GMT
If and when I do my secondary series electric conversion it will include a modern 5kw diesel generator at the front of the boat. The idea being that if it is successful there is the option to remove the main engine and replace with batteries.
I don't think an install without a diesel unit is going to be a viable option in the foreseeable future for a cruising vessel not relying on shore based electric.
It would be nice but it won't happen soon.
Diesel is king and will remain so for inland boating for a loooong time I suspect. At least another 25 years.
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Post by JohnV on Feb 9, 2019 15:12:56 GMT
For the moment a cruising regime such as Peter likes (fairly short days) is fine in summer as the power production during the main part of a summer day will be pretty well cover the moving part of the power requirement and the rest of daylight time should cover a large proportion of his domestic needs (remember he has a whispergen for extra power plus hot water) During the winter his moving requirements are even lower and he has a mooring with shore power. It is not a practical solution yet for my canal cruising pattern. My yoghurt pot has insufficient roof area to provide much solar charging with the present efficiencies and also limited space for sufficient power storage even using LiFePO4. My cruising pattern is very long days although domestic power requirements are very low. On Sabina the requirement of high power levels for possibly long periods (sea passages and river work) plus high domestic requirements also make it unsuitable ......... but I don't think it will be that many years.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 9, 2019 15:59:39 GMT
great news. I enjoy silent cruising, watching the wildlife that is unaware of my presence, Ah yes. The old English Blind Ducks. Always nice to see them and give a little nod or tip the hat. Even if they don't see you. which they won't on account of them having no eyes.
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Post by bodger on Feb 9, 2019 16:09:23 GMT
.............. or the kingfisher that landed on the back of the cabin top and watched me carefully for a while before deciding that it didn't really need a free ride and I probably wasn't edible. It was surreal - I had never seen one so close and stationary for so long (about 5 minutes). I decided that if I reached for the camera it would probably fly off, so unfortunately I never got any photographic evidence. Near Burcot, May 2018.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 9, 2019 16:21:43 GMT
Nice. The bird was "aware of your presence" but judged that you were no threat. That is indeed a very pleasant side effect of an electric boat.
I love electric boats. I put a motor in y canoe and dinghy but the range is a real problem for the other boats.
Some sort of major leap forward similar to the invention of Neodymium magnets in 1983 needs to happen. I don't believe Lithium batteries will be the answer. They may provide a solution at the moment but their development and that of electric cars is mainly taking place in order to improve battery technology itself. whoever does that is going to end up not only being very very rich but possibly having a major impact on the future survival of humans.
Bringing power distribution to a more local and individual level has got to be a Good Thing but it needs effective storage.
Maaaan.
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Post by peterboat on Feb 9, 2019 16:38:16 GMT
If and when I do my secondary series electric conversion it will include a modern 5kw diesel generator at the front of the boat. The idea being that if it is successful there is the option to remove the main engine and replace with batteries. I don't think an install without a diesel unit is going to be a viable option in the foreseeable future for a cruising vessel not relying on shore based electric. It would be nice but it won't happen soon. Diesel is king and will remain so for inland boating for a loooong time I suspect. At least another 25 years. But at what price Andrew? if diesel is a fortune a litre what price electric then. Thats the issue for me I am happy doing 2 hours a day then charging through solar if needed, and given that its supposed to get hotter rather than colder, I am safe for the future
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Post by bodger on Feb 9, 2019 16:49:52 GMT
........ given that its supposed to get hotter rather than colder, I am safe for the future let us hope for many more summers like 2018.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 9, 2019 17:09:11 GMT
If and when I do my secondary series electric conversion it will include a modern 5kw diesel generator at the front of the boat. The idea being that if it is successful there is the option to remove the main engine and replace with batteries. I don't think an install without a diesel unit is going to be a viable option in the foreseeable future for a cruising vessel not relying on shore based electric. It would be nice but it won't happen soon. Diesel is king and will remain so for inland boating for a loooong time I suspect. At least another 25 years. But at what price Andrew? if diesel is a fortune a litre what price electric then. Thats the issue for me I am happy doing 2 hours a day then charging through solar if needed, and given that its supposed to get hotter rather than colder, I am safe for the future People always talk about oil prices going up continuously but if you look at the data crude oil is cheaper now than it was in 1980. www.macrotrends.net/1369/crude-oil-price-history-chart So who knows it might be even cheaper in 2048... and well made diesel engines will still be runnning (other than foxy's Bukh which will succumb to excess oil changes and cleaning with toothbrushes). I know this excludes taxes and potential legal action so yes diesel may become considerably more expensive but it would really have to go through the roof to make electric viable. I mean in large scale not individual home built projects. Oil is just far too effective.
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