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Post by Clinton Cool on Jun 10, 2020 21:18:15 GMT
Oh, so you are talking as a multiple entity? Not as an individual? You have to check, as you can self identify as anything these days. Myself I only talk for myself and of my own experiences generally. Well I didn't personally make any comments that could be construed as being racist towards the Irish so the 'we' referred to the population as a whole.
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Post by kris on Jun 10, 2020 21:20:12 GMT
Oh, so you are talking as a multiple entity? Not as an individual? You have to check, as you can self identify as anything these days. Myself I only talk for myself and of my own experiences generally. Well I didn't personally make any comments that could be construed as being racist towards the Irish so the 'we' referred to the population as a whole. So your putting your self up as a spokes person for the whole population?
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Post by Deleted on Jun 10, 2020 21:21:44 GMT
As far as I’m concerned you can do as you please. 'We', not 'me'. And sadly that 'we' includes you. This freedom of speech thing has some major flaws.
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Post by Clinton Cool on Jun 10, 2020 21:27:11 GMT
Well I didn't personally make any comments that could be construed as being racist towards the Irish so the 'we' referred to the population as a whole. So your putting your self up as a spokes person for the whole population? Not at all. I'll put it in a different way, hopefully you'll now understand: I think it's considered racist if people make derogatory statements about the Irish.
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Post by Mr Stabby on Jun 10, 2020 21:27:16 GMT
Personally, if I was a descendant of African slaves, I’d be going for financial reparation from the financial institutions and companies that became very rich off the back of slavery and are still very rich today. By the same token, perhaps Lewis Hamilton should offer to pay for the restoration of the Edward Colston statue because if Eddie hadn't given his ancestors a free boat ride then Lewis would still be running round semi-naked in the jungle getting eaten by lions rather than living in a multi-million pound apartment in Monaco and shagging a top model.
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Post by kris on Jun 10, 2020 21:29:06 GMT
Personally, if I was a descendant of African slaves, I’d be going for financial reparation from the financial institutions and companies that became very rich off the back of slavery and are still very rich today. By the same token, perhaps Lewis Hamilton should offer to pay for the restoration of the Edward Colston statue because if Eddie hadn't given his ancestors a free boat ride then Lewis would still be running round semi-naked in the jungle getting eaten by lions rather than living in a multi-million pound apartment in Monaco and shagging a top model. Anything is possible, it seems in this new normal we find ourselves in.
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Post by kris on Jun 10, 2020 21:30:06 GMT
So your putting your self up as a spokes person for the whole population? Not at all. I'll put it in a different way, hopefully you'll now understand: I think it's considered racist if people make derogatory statements about the Irish. Your entitled to think what you like.
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Post by Clinton Cool on Jun 10, 2020 21:30:41 GMT
By the same token, perhaps Lewis Hamilton should offer to pay for the restoration of the Edward Colston statue because if Eddie hadn't given his ancestors a free boat ride then Lewis would still be running round semi-naked in the jungle getting eaten by lions rather than living in a multi-million pound apartment in Monaco and shagging a top model. Anything is possible, it seems in this new normal we find ourselves in. Apart from me shagging a top model.
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Post by Mr Stabby on Jun 10, 2020 21:33:43 GMT
Thank God we're still allowed to hate gingers.
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Post by kris on Jun 10, 2020 21:35:46 GMT
Anything is possible, it seems in this new normal we find ourselves in. Apart from me shagging a top model. Isnt it time you moved on from this teenager like fascination?
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Post by Telemachus on Jun 10, 2020 21:39:19 GMT
I’m not into the removal of statues, I’d go after the living descendants of slavers who are still living off the proceeds and the companies and financial institutions who profited and still profit from the slave trade. Much more productive than removing the statues of a few old dead blokes. I think your desire to seek financial retribution is misplaced. Throughout history there has been lots of unfairness and bad things done to others. So it just depends on how far back you want to go, and how thorough you want to be. If you are going to go after the descendants of slavers to make a point, what about their other legacies such as all the buildings, institutions and charities. Should they be pulled down / destroyed/ dissolved? And what about all those same things that arose from other aspects of the British empire? If you are going to get rid of all those, there isn’t going to be much left except the odd 1960s council estate and shopping complex. and how far back do you want to go? Let’s go after all the descendants of the Normans who invaded England (eeek that’s probably me), or maybe it should be the descendants of the Romans? And on BLM in USA, how come the blacks are clamouring about them being victims of slavery whilst not giving a shit that the entire USA was founded on genocide and the stealing of land from the native Americans. It’s all about portraying yourself as a victim and using that as an excuse to try to grab something. And what about the Africans who cheerfully sold their fellow citizens to the slave traders for profit, the Arabs who enslaved anyone they could find etc etc. Clearly there is a huge problem with racism in the USA and still some problem in UK, but when extremists get involved with a selective desire to use history to grab something they didn’t work for, the fundamental point is lost. It is effectively the same as looting. Which is a shame.
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Post by Telemachus on Jun 10, 2020 21:44:14 GMT
Incidentally, I voted yes because I hate races. Horse races, formula 1, silly people running on a track getting all sweaty, pedalling their bicycles frantically. All completely pointless and should be segregated so normal decent people don’t have to see them.
Except glider races of course, they are Cooooalall
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Post by kris on Jun 10, 2020 21:56:27 GMT
I’m not into the removal of statues, I’d go after the living descendants of slavers who are still living off the proceeds and the companies and financial institutions who profited and still profit from the slave trade. Much more productive than removing the statues of a few old dead blokes. I think your desire to seek financial retribution is misplaced. Throughout history there has been lots of unfairness and bad things done to others. So it just depends on how far back you want to go, and how thorough you want to be. If you are going to go after the descendants of slavers to make a point, what about their other legacies such as all the buildings, institutions and charities. Should they be pulled down / destroyed/ dissolved? And what about all those same things that arose from other aspects of the British empire? If you are going to get rid of all those, there isn’t going to be much left except the odd 1960s council estate and shopping complex. and how far back do you want to go? Let’s go after all the descendants of the Normans who invaded England (eeek that’s probably me), or maybe it should be the descendants of the Romans? And on BLM in USA, how come the blacks are clamouring about them being victims of slavery whilst not giving a shit that the entire USA was founded on genocide and the stealing of land from the native Americans. It’s all about portraying yourself as a victim and using that as an excuse to try to grab something. And what about the Africans who cheerfully sold their fellow citizens to the slave traders for profit, the Arabs who enslaved anyone they could find etc etc. Clearly there is a huge problem with racism in the USA and still some problem in UK, but when extremists get involved with a selective desire to use history to grab something they didn’t work for, the fundamental point is lost. It is effectively the same as looting. Which is a shame. Despite your propensity for verbosity, I do tend to read your posts as you make some good points. As you do in this one. But in reply, I wouldn’t call it a desire. I gave my statement context by saying if I was a descendant of an African slave. Which if I was it would be logical to go after the money. As lots of records of this era are still available it is often possible to trace who directly profited off which slaves. Which isn’t often the case in many of the other examples you give of unfairness throughout history. So it would seem to make sense for the descendants of African slaves to band together and take class actions against the individuals, institutions and companies who profited. Of course you don’t pull down the buildings and society that has been built out of it. Anyway I’ve lost my train of thought. But just to say I agree with lots the points you make, but they don’t take away from the case for financial reparations.
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Post by Clinton Cool on Jun 10, 2020 22:21:35 GMT
Apart from me shagging a top model. Isnt it time you moved on from this teenager like fascination? I have largely. A few years ago I used to think about it all the time. Nowadays it's not so frequent. The time I save isn't wasted, instead, I think about surfing, collecting razor clams and the wonders that are industrial anglepoise lamps.
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Post by Telemachus on Jun 10, 2020 22:37:03 GMT
I think it depends on whether you think it is right to punish people for the sins of their great, great (etc etc) grandfathers who dId stuff that was normal, wasn’t a crime or considered immoral or a sin at the time. I think it’s always dangerous to judge and punish people for stuff done a long time ago, using the current versions of law and morality. Otherwise know as retrospective judging and law making.
If something you did 20 years ago that was perfectly normal, reasonable and legal at the time, suddenly became illegal for some reason, you would be pretty pissed off to get a knock on the door from Mr Plod armed with an arrest warrant. Just as an example, let’s say Greta becomes president of the world in 20 years time because the whole international zeitgeist has become about climate change /carbon emissions etc. Looking back, it is unthinkable how people could have been so selfish and stupid as to burn fossil fuels for pleasure even after there was widespread knowledge about the damage it was doing. She not only bans all Diesel engines, but also seeks to prosecute anyone who in the past has ever used a Diesel engine in a leisure activity. I doubt you would like that much.
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