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Post by cygnus on Mar 23, 2018 13:18:42 GMT
I have just had a reply by email from the Canal & River Trust concerning my Freedom of Information request regarding the widebeam licence cost increase.
Apparently there are 5857 widebeam boats that will pay the increased licence fee.
They are expecting to raise approximately 500,000 pounds extra per year plus inflation.
I asked if they could give me an estimated cost of my licence in 2023, ie 60' x 14'. They said that due to FOI rules no specific information could be supplied for a privately owned craft. However a back of an envelope calculation probably means it'll be something like 250/300 quid a year extra assuming inflation stays steady at about 2 - 3%. So perhaps a total licence cost of 1200 - 1300 pounds.
I must admit I thought that the extra revenue raised would have been over a million quid a year
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Post by TonyDunkley on Mar 23, 2018 13:40:54 GMT
I have just had a reply by email from the Canal & River Trust concerning my Freedom of Information request regarding the widebeam licence cost increase. Apparently there are 5857 widebeam boats that will pay the increased licence fee. They are expecting to raise approximately 500,000 pounds extra per year plus inflation. I asked if they could give me an estimated cost of my licence in 2023, ie 60' x 14'. They said that due to FOI rules no specific information could be supplied for a privately owned craft. However a back of an envelope calculation probably means it'll be something like 250/300 quid a year extra assuming inflation stays steady at about 2 - 3%. So perhaps a total licence cost of 1200 - 1300 pounds. I must admit I thought that the extra revenue raised would have been over a million quid a year I'm a little surprised that you've got a Licence rather than a registration certificate (PBC), . . from the photos of your boat the wheelhouse looks too high for the bridges along the canal from Goole.
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Post by phil70 on Mar 23, 2018 14:25:47 GMT
To be honest, fat boats have had it easy up to now The rule on the Broads for many years has been that license is calculated on length times beam ..... simple Phil
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Post by kris on Mar 23, 2018 14:57:40 GMT
I have just had a reply by email from the Canal & River Trust concerning my Freedom of Information request regarding the widebeam licence cost increase. Apparently there are 5857 widebeam boats that will pay the increased licence fee. They are expecting to raise approximately 500,000 pounds extra per year plus inflation. I asked if they could give me an estimated cost of my licence in 2023, ie 60' x 14'. They said that due to FOI rules no specific information could be supplied for a privately owned craft. However a back of an envelope calculation probably means it'll be something like 250/300 quid a year extra assuming inflation stays steady at about 2 - 3%. So perhaps a total licence cost of 1200 - 1300 pounds. I must admit I thought that the extra revenue raised would have been over a million quid a year very interesting thanks for posting this. I bet there a few people in goole not happy about the increase?
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Post by kris on Mar 23, 2018 14:59:15 GMT
To be honest, fat boats have had it easy up to now The rule on the Broads for many years has been that license is calculated on length times beam ..... simple Phil the difference is all of the broads are available to widebeams, whereas on Crt waterways approx 33% is open to widebeams. So not so simple as you'd like to think.
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Post by TonyDunkley on Mar 23, 2018 15:21:35 GMT
To be honest, fat boats have had it easy up to now The rule on the Broads for many years has been that license is calculated on length times beam ..... simple Phil the difference is all of the broads are available to widebeams, whereas on Crt waterways approx 33% is open to widebeams. So not so simple as you'd like to think. I would think it's a good bit more than 33% of C&RT's waters that are open to 12' 6'' - 14' 0" beam craft, kris, but your point is valid. To be completely fair about things, C&RT should not only be discounting Licences for wideboats, but they should also be knocking a bit off the Licence fee for narrowbeam stuff that's too long to get through some of the shorter locks in the North.
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Post by kris on Mar 23, 2018 15:44:34 GMT
the difference is all of the broads are available to widebeams, whereas on Crt waterways approx 33% is open to widebeams. So not so simple as you'd like to think. I would think it's a good bit more than 33% of C&RT's waters that are open to 12' 6'' - 14' 0" beam craft, kris, but your point is valid. To be completely fair about things, C&RT should not only be discounting Licences for wideboats, but they should also be knocking a bit off the Licence fee for narrowbeam stuff that's too long to get through some of the shorter locks in the North. as I've said on here before Tony, it's the adverse effect on the ex-commercial craft of the nortern waterways that I dislike most, as I'm sure it will lead to more of these being lost to the waterways as they become less atracttive because of the increased costs.
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Post by cygnus on Mar 23, 2018 15:51:29 GMT
I would say there are about 200 boats wider than a Narrowboat in Goole, so maybe 150 paying the extra 20%. Many of these widebeams are around 30' long. Didn't they even consider the smaller GRP or wooden cruisers? Yes Kris there are quite a few disgruntled boat owners here in Goole, after all having a 30' cruiser and paying the same as a 40 odd foot Narrowboat doesn't seem right when they have a much reduced cruising area.
My airdraft is 10ft Tony, so my inland waterways cruising area is basically Ouse to York, Trent to Nottingham, Aire & Calder to Leeds, and of course the S & SY Navigations.
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Post by TonyDunkley on Mar 23, 2018 16:39:22 GMT
My airdraft is 10ft Tony, so my inland waterways cruising area is basically Ouse to York, Trent to Nottingham, Aire & Calder to Leeds, and of course the S & SY Navigations. Ah, . . it's less than looks from the photos, then. I was thinking that if she was too high for lowest bridges along the canal to the West of Goole then you could save yourself a tidy sum off the Licence fee every year by taking out a River Registration instead. As things stand now, if you do have a standard boat Licence, then you're paying through the nose for the use of just two relatively short lengths of canal, the South Yorkshire canal from Bramwith to Rotherham/Sheffield and the Aire & Calder from Knottingley to Leeds, whereas the PBC (C&RT's phoney 'Rivers only Licence') permits free passage through the canals between the Trent and the Ouse for an unspecified/unlimited number of periods of up to 72 hours each.
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Post by naughtyfox on Mar 23, 2018 16:48:37 GMT
It's not always easy deciding what kind of 'licence' to get. When we'll do the Thames Oxford to Reading, I believe it's cheaper to get a 2-day-pass from the EA (?), but then, we might like to do it slower and get the 7-day thingy. Although where we can park the boat for the night who knows, as those people who own those mansions with manicured lawns down to the river's edge are well-known to be arseholes of the Highest Order.
it's a bit like driving from Finland to England - we could drive to Umeå via Haparanda, but that is 8 hours' driving (tiredness and wear-&-tear on the car's transmission and petrol cost) compared to the 2 hours' driving to Vaasa and the rip-off ferry fare.
Sometimes it's best to just pay up and take it easy.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 23, 2018 16:59:01 GMT
To be honest, fat boats have had it easy up to now The rule on the Broads for many years has been that license is calculated on length times beam ..... simple Phil the difference is all of the broads are available to widebeams, whereas on Crt waterways approx 33% is open to widebeams. So not so simple as you'd like to think. Nobody holds a gun to your head and says you have to have a wide boat. Unless people are remarkably clueless (possible) I think there is a good chance they would be aware of the limited cruising area.
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Post by kris on Mar 23, 2018 18:26:19 GMT
the difference is all of the broads are available to widebeams, whereas on Crt waterways approx 33% is open to widebeams. So not so simple as you'd like to think. Nobody holds a gun to your head and says you have to have a wide boat. Unless people are remarkably clueless (possible) I think there is a good chance they would be aware of the limited cruising area. yet again you miss the point.
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Post by naughtyfox on Mar 23, 2018 18:43:37 GMT
I think the widebeam/narrowboat nonsense is really very silly. I don't see what's wrong with a mix of boat sizes, it makes life more interesting. Widebeams may take up more room but can't get around the system as much as narrowboats that wear the system out by rubbing against lock gates as they're too lazy to open the other gate.
Perhaps there should be just ONE licence fee, as, regardless of length or width, the system is 'used' just as much (or can be if they wish) by all boats.
The real crime is the reckless waste of funds by a very inept organisation that should have long ago been hauled across the coals by Parliament.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 23, 2018 18:48:13 GMT
Nobody holds a gun to your head and says you have to have a wide boat. Unless people are remarkably clueless (possible) I think there is a good chance they would be aware of the limited cruising area. yet again you miss the point. Ok please enlighten me as to what you think the point is. I'm happy to be educated. Charging by area is the obvious way to do it. Its been coming for years and years. Was only a matter of when. And as for it causing the scrapping of old boats - old buildings get demolished all the time for new built. For better or worse its known as Change.
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Post by kris on Mar 23, 2018 18:54:58 GMT
Your alright there's no point trying to educate you.
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