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Post by Deleted on May 22, 2016 17:42:52 GMT
A great post Paul,I really enjoyed that.California in the 50s and 60s wow.I used to read a lot about that,Haight Ashbury,Ken Kesey,Tom Wolf,Hunter Thomson,Tom Wolf I really enjoyed. I graduated from high school in 1968 and immediately started attending University of San Francisco, a nice, conservative Jesuit university just across the panhandle from "The Haight", as it was called then. By 1969 I had an apartment right on the corner of Haight Street and Ashbury Avenue. Careful Paul,I will be asking about your record collection in a minute. I love that beautiful country rock that sort of straddles the late sixties into the mid seventies,JD Souther,Neil Young,Eagles though perhaps the most commercially successful but far from the epitome
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Post by quaysider on May 22, 2016 20:26:03 GMT
Wow - Gentlemen, I humbly thank you for your reasoned and educated responses. Seriously - not one thing I've read in the last 10 mins has either offended or belittled me. OK - so I've had a few beers in the garden this afternoon but even in my "relaxed" state, can appreciate the time and effort you've all put in.
If you don't mind, I'll re-read again in the morning and respond... CWDF are missing out on some well articulated and informed debate - their loss I feel.
Thanks all.
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Post by PaulG2 on May 23, 2016 2:11:47 GMT
And what is your interest in the inland waterways and canal boats, if I may ask?... To make a long story short.... I've been a boater all my life; learned to navigate when I was 14 y.o. Mostly I'm a lumpy water sort, but I fell in love with the idea of barging Europe for a swan song. Three years ago I was in the process of buying a Luxemotor barge and I joined DBA because it seemed like a good information base but I didn't get on well with some of the regulars there, so I quit DBA. I happened upon CWDF during this time and found the forum and the people interesting and welcoming. Just about the time the ink was drying on the purchase contract, I found out I had colon cancer and had to deal with that instead of buying a boat. I got rid of the colon cancer but then a bypass in my left femoral artery re-occluded and I couldn't walk more than about 50' without stopping and resting and that was fixed last October. Meanwhile, I have a son just finishing 9th grade. Three years ago I could have taken him to Europe and lived on the barge and he would have adapted. Once kids start middle school, seventh grade, they start making friends for life and uprooting them from their school is tough on them. My son has straight A grades in honors classes, so his education takes priority in my life and that means staying put here for three more years. As soon as I can, though, I want to get out this country. I cannot support the American penchant for endless war, and looking at the political landscape here, there is no end in sight to the control of our government by the pertro-chemical companies, MIC and various Wall Street and banking interests that all profit from our endless wars. If I am physically able to navigate a barge when I leave here, I will get a barge and live on it. I also want to buy an apartment in Greece, near Glyfada, as I like that area and it seems like a good place to spend my final years. There's an amphitheater at the Acropolis that has been there for thousands of years. Picture a warm July evening, stars shining above and a warm breeze blowing gently. As an outrageously gorgeous Russian babe snuggles up next to you, you watch a ballet just as people have been doing from that very spot for thousands of years. Been there, done that, wanna do it some more - as does the gorgeous Russian babe. Anyway, right now I have a lot of free time on my hands and I find you ladies and gents to be an interesting and, for the most part, friendly crowd and I enjoy conversing with you. And let's face it, once you've walked on water, it just just easier to communicate with others who have done the same.
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Post by Deleted on May 23, 2016 5:41:14 GMT
Wow - Gentlemen, I humbly thank you for your reasoned and educated responses. Seriously - not one thing I've read in the last 10 mins has either offended or belittled me. OK - so I've had a few beers in the garden this afternoon but even in my "relaxed" state, can appreciate the time and effort you've all put in. If you don't mind, I'll re-read again in the morning and respond... CWDF are missing out on some well articulated and informed debate - their loss I feel. Thanks all. The life you are leading on those Royalty Payments,commissioning boats to be built,paying for moorings in advance, whatever happened to drugs,hookers and throwing tv sets through windows ? you let me down
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Post by Clinton Cool on May 23, 2016 6:24:29 GMT
A lot of what has been said is true. However, there's a major factor that's been ignored, that has little to do with large corporations or party political stances.
Not so long ago much of what was consumed in any given country was produced in that country. There were imports and exports, sure, but on nothing like the scale we have today. So, where in the past, for example, a power tool would be made in Britain it's today almost certainly made elsewhere. China would be a good punt. The British worker enjoyed reasonable wages and decent working conditions. We can attribute much of this to the trade union movement and health and safety advances, both socialist inspired ideas. This is not to make a political point, but the fact should not be ignored.
Down the road in China workers are expected, and are prepared to, work long hours for subsistence pay. Health and safety is a long way down the pecking list in terms of things that are important. So, despite the tremendous distances involved, almost everything is made cheaper in China.
Good luck to the Chinese. They have their culture and traditions and their strong work ethic.
Back in Britain, with workers not been prepared to work 12 hours a day in dangerous conditions in order that they can feed their family. Unfortunately for them, with the Chinese stuff being much cheaper, their factory closes and they lose their jobs.
The mistake that's been made is allowing too much free international trade. Tarrifs could have been used to create a level playing field between imports and products made at home. Instead of tarrifs we had governments who aided more international trade whilst, at the same time, acting on socialist lobbying to provide high levels of health and safety, an expensive welfare system, green levies, and the like. All these things of course make British made goods even more expensive than they were before.
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Post by peterboat on May 23, 2016 10:58:11 GMT
Osborne today seems to be getting increasing hysterical in how the world is going to end if we leave the EU! Is it me picking it up wrong or do others think the same?
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Post by Deleted on May 23, 2016 11:11:12 GMT
Osborne today seems to be getting increasing hysterical in how the world is going to end if we leave the EU! Is it me picking it up wrong or do others think the same? Frankly the whole stay in campaign is losing the plot. The question to ask is whether you want people like this allow the super powerful rich to run Europe and eventually the world? That's where it's heading folks, world power to a handful of very super rich people. Why on earth does anyone think moving control further up the tree is a good thing for the general population when we can't even trust our own politicians? Never mind Europian ones. While humanity carries on using the monetary system to determine ones 'weath' this will only get worse...and no...I'm not sure how you change it
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Post by peterboat on May 23, 2016 11:38:02 GMT
Its on R2 now no cohesive argument from the inners for me the outers on this debate are winning the day
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Post by Deleted on May 23, 2016 11:54:39 GMT
Its on R2 now no cohesive argument from the inners for me the outers on this debate are winning the day ...but what about the '1' and '0's'?
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Post by Deleted on May 23, 2016 12:08:08 GMT
Osborne today seems to be getting increasing hysterical in how the world is going to end if we leave the EU! Is it me picking it up wrong or do others think the same? Frankly the whole stay in campaign is losing the plot. The question to ask is whether you want people like this allow the super powerful rich to run Europe and eventually the world? That's where it's heading folks, world power to a handful of very super rich people. Why on earth does anyone think moving control further up the tree is a good thing for the general population when we can't even trust our own politicians? Never mind Europian ones. While humanity carries on using the monetary system to determine ones 'weath' this will only get worse...and no...I'm not sure how you change it Is the Out campaign reaching all parts of the Electorate,thats my worry.Quaysider put a post up here yesterday,I don't know if you read it ? To be fair it was easily challenged point by point but I do hope he is in isolation regarding his narrative.
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Post by Deleted on May 23, 2016 12:31:21 GMT
Frankly the whole stay in campaign is losing the plot. The question to ask is whether you want people like this allow the super powerful rich to run Europe and eventually the world? That's where it's heading folks, world power to a handful of very super rich people. Why on earth does anyone think moving control further up the tree is a good thing for the general population when we can't even trust our own politicians? Never mind Europian ones. While humanity carries on using the monetary system to determine ones 'weath' this will only get worse...and no...I'm not sure how you change it Is the Out campaign reaching all parts of the Electorate,thats my worry.Quaysider put a post up here yesterday,I don't know if you read it ? To be fair it was easily challenged point by point but I do hope he is in isolation regarding his narrative. Easily challenged? What are you on about?
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Post by sabcat on May 23, 2016 13:04:23 GMT
As I'm discussing this and openly asking people's opinions in real life about this, I'm finding more and more of the older ones - the ones who are ALREADY financially secure, who've already made their money from good pension pots and massively inflated house prices... the ones who really don't need to worry about the value of THEIR homes (as their - in comparison tiny mortgages have LONG since been paid off) ARE keen to exit. Our parents are respectfullly included in this! It does appear in some cases they are voting for what they believe to be for the good of all - BUT with scant thought about their own kids, who've HAD to borrow massive amounts in order to be able to buy our homes - many of us, still with many years left on our mortgages... for whom, an equalisation (if we must call it that) in property values would be disastrous... if you read the terms of your mortgages, the "fekcers - sorry lenders" can at any time, re-value your property AND request we reduce THEIR risk! - Just take a look at all the buy to let landlords, teetering on the edge that companies such as paragon "push" over - JUST to be able to take the property into their OWN distressed property management company in order to be able to charge fees... thus generating an income stream to replace some of what they lost when they were unable to lend as much as they had been doing... Many of our friends are so blinkered, looking back at rose coloured memories of times before Europe. I'm not sure if they are able to look rationally at the potential for economic disaster and instability - the crash of 2008 will seem like a walk in the park compared to riots on the streets. The uk does seem to have become a nation that doesn't WANT to work hard to build a better society - ME on the other hand, have to work 70+ hours a week to pay my way and achieve anything. I could sit on my arse, light up a fag and head down the off-licence to buy cheap cider like many do ... but I don't - instead, I slog on trying to keep my head above water, pay my bills and "hope" for a time when I'll have enough saved to live on once the mortgage is paid down. Whilst I do agree, we've given up too much to Europe already, I also think that in basic terms, the child in the playground that stamps his feet and refuses to play any more because he didn't win a particular game will engender little if any respect from the other kids - HOW can he work to make the rules of the game better, if he's taken his toys home? - I'm NOT pro EU but I do have to stand by my decision and vote. I voted tory but hoped for another coalition - the lib dems did act as a conscience and deserve more credit for the good they did last time round. OK - so cameron lies... they all do... WE all do - it's called politics and diplomacy for a reason... but surely they know more about the complex world of macro economics than the rest of us do? - don't they? I think I'm still back to my coin on 23rd June ;-) Class Tory voting wanker, it's all going to come in around your ears but it's not your fault, you work hard, it's other people who don't want to work. Suck it up.
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Post by Deleted on May 23, 2016 13:25:04 GMT
The bottom line is that we all have things to offer to the greater society.
Lots of people care for their elderly parents for example, and don't charge them £1000 per week...yes, that's a typical fee for a care home.
Lots of people stay at home to look after their young children and don't charge for it.
Lots of people do charity work for nothing.
The monetary system is a con based on a lack of trust for eachother. It allows people to be 'valued' more than they really are to humanity.
...but hey...it's nice to be able to drive a Jag. Nothing wrong with that either. It's just wrong that we can't use all our skills and gifts to make this world a better place.
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Post by sabcat on May 23, 2016 13:33:19 GMT
For anyone interesting in the macro economic picture (especially Tory boy who thinks they know more about what's going on than us) take a look at the treasury forecasts for the last 8 years. They have, without exception been wrong. Then take a look at the latest economic data we have for the UK and Europe. Then come back and tell us that they know better or that Brexit or not is going to make the slightest difference to whether there's a recession at the end of this year or not.
Put as simply as possible what's happened to house prices is an asset bubble, this has been caused by a general lack (for almost 2 decades) of a productive way to deploy capital. For your ordinary bod reaching retirement it's meant that a pension annuity (money invested as productive capital) is a piss poor purchase compared to a couple of flats to rent out which gives a rental return and a return on capital. Think about that for a moment, what it means. Our economy, the world economy, is so fucked that the best way to make money is to rent something out. That's not production. It's not growth. It's what happens when there is no growth. The only real growth there's been since 2008 is in debt and debt is a claim on the future. When the claims on the future are growing faster than real growth in the economy that debt becomes trash and since 2008 debt has grown faster than real economic activity. That is going to crunch, indeed has started to crunch, this year. It's best viewed as a continuation of the 2008 crisis because ultimately the causes of the 2008 crisis were never resolved.
tl;dr Brexit or not, the economy is fucked and so are your house prices.
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Post by Deleted on May 23, 2016 13:42:54 GMT
For anyone interesting in the macro economic picture (especially Tory boy who thinks they know more about what's going on than us) take a look at the treasury forecasts for the last 8 years. They have, without exception been wrong. Then take a look at the latest economic data we have for the UK and Europe. Then come back and tell us that they know better or that Brexit or not is going to make the slightest difference to whether there's a recession at the end of this year or not. Put as simply as possible what's happened to house prices is an asset bubble, this has been caused by a general lack (for almost 2 decades) of a productive way to deploy capital. For your ordinary bod reaching retirement it's meant that a pension annuity (money invested as productive capital) is a piss poor purchase compared to a couple of flats to rent out which gives a rental return and a return on capital. Think about that for a moment, what it means. Our economy, the world economy, is so fucked that the best way to make money is to rent something out. That's not production. It's not growth. It's what happens when there is no growth. The only real growth there's been since 2008 is in debt and debt is a claim on the future. When the claims on the future are growing faster than real growth in the economy that debt becomes trash and since 2008 debt has grown faster than real economic activity. That is going to crunch, indeed has started to crunch, this year. It's best viewed as a continuation of the 2008 crisis because ultimately the causes of the 2008 crisis were never resolved. tl;dr Brexit or not, the economy is fucked and so are your house prices. That's because the older generation are using our children. If our children stopped paying into their pensions our monthly pension payments would stop. There is no buffer because the bankers use it to make the super rich richer. There you go..
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